• Thursday, November 21, 2019

India vs. Pakistan: Who Wins in a War (And How Many Millions Could Die)?

Discussion in 'Indian Defence Forum' started by kahonapyarhai, Feb 16, 2019.

  1. kahonapyarhai

    kahonapyarhai SENIOR MEMBER

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    For its part, the Indian army plans to immediately take the offensive under a doctrine called “ Cold Start .” Cold Start envisions rapid mobilization followed by a major offensive into Pakistan before the country can respond with tactical nuclear weapons. Such an offensive—and Pakistan’s likely conventional defeat—could make the use of tactical nuclear weapons all the more likely .

    The Indian subcontinent is home to two of the largest armies on Earth. Not only are the armies of India and Pakistan both larger in personnel than the U.S. Army, but they have stood at alert facing one another since the dissolution of the British Indian Army in 1947. The two armies have clashed four times in the past seventy years, and may yet do so again in the future.

    The Indian army is the primary land force of the Indian armed forces. The army numbers 1.2 million active duty personnel and 990,000 reservists, for a total force strength of 2.1 million. The army’s primary tasks are guarding the borders with Pakistan and China and domestic security—particularly in Kashmir and the Northeast. The army is also a frequent contributor to United Nations peacekeeping missions abroad.



    The army is structured into fourteen army corps, which are further made up of forty infantry, armored, mountain and RAPID (mechanized infantry) divisions. There is approximately one separate artillery brigade per corps, five separate armored brigades, seven infantry brigades and five brigade-sized air defense formations.

    Infantry and mountain divisions are mostly assigned to the mountainous North and Northeast regions, where manpower intensive counterinsurgency and mountain warfare forces are important, while infantry, RAPID, and armored formations sit on the border opposite Pakistan. Perhaps unusually the Indian army has only one airborne unit, the Parachute Regiment, which is actually an umbrella headquarters for army airborne and special forces. The Parachute Regiment controls seven special-forces battalions and three airborne brigades.

    The army is equipped from a number of sources, primarily Russia and a growing domestic arms industry, with increasing amounts of Israeli and American weaponry. More than 4,000 tanks equip the country’s ninety-seven armored regiments (the equivalent of American battalions), including 2,400 older T-72 tanks, 1,600 T-90 tanks, and approximately 360 Arjun Mk.1 and Mk.2 tanks. Complementing the T-72/90 tanks in armored and mechanized infantry formations are BMP-2 mechanized infantry combat vehicles.

    Most of the Indian Army’s 4,000 artillery pieces are from Russia, including newer 300-millimeter Smerch multiple launch rocket systems, but the country appears to be turning away from Russian field artillery towards American towed M777 and South Korean K-9 Thunder self-propelled howitzers. A new howitzer, the Dhanush, appears close to widespread adoption. Air defense artillery, on the other hand, is dominated by Russian equipment, from battlefield Tunguska self-propelled anti-aircraft guns to S-400 “Triumf” high-altitude air-defense missiles.

    The Pakistani army numbers 650,000 active duty personnel and five hundred thousand reserves, for a total strength of 1.15 million. Although Pakistan resides in what most would consider a rough neighborhood, it is on relatively good terms with neighbors China and Iran. As a result, the army’s primary missions are domestic security operations against the Pakistani Taliban and facing off against the Indian army. Like India, Pakistan is a major contributor of forces to United Nations peacekeeping missions.

    The Pakistani army consists of twenty-six combat divisions falling under the control of nine army corps. Most divisions are infantry divisions, with only two armored and two mechanized infantry divisions. Each corps also controls an average of one armored, one infantry and one artillery brigade each. Not only is the Pakistani army smaller than the Indian army, but it features fewer offensive forces capable of attacking India head-on. Special operations forces are concentrated under the control of the Special Services Group, which controls eight commando battalions.

    The army’s equipment is mostly Pakistani and Chinese, with Turkish and American armaments in key areas. The country has fewer than seven hundred frontline tanks, including the Khalid and the T-80UD, with another one thousand modernized versions of the 1970s-era Chinese Type 59. Pakistan lacks a modern infantry fighting vehicle, relying on more than two thousand upgraded M113 tracked armored personnel carriers.


    Pakistan has nearly two thousand artillery pieces, primarily Chinese and American, but they are older models with little in terms of acquisitions in sight. Standouts among these are roughly 250 M109A5 155-millimeter self-propelled howitzers and two hundred A-100E 300-millimeter multiple launch rocket systems—similar to India’s Smerch. One standout category where Pakistani weapons outmatch Indian ones is the area of attack helicopters, where the country fields fifty-one older AH-1S Cobra attack helicopters with another fifteen AH-1Z Vipers on order.

    If the two countries went to war, a major clash between the two armies would be inevitable. Outnumbered and under-equipped, the Pakistani army believes it is in a position to launch small local offensives from the outset, before the Indian army can reach its jumping-off points, to occupy favorable terrain. Still, the disparity in forces means the Pakistanis cannot hope to launch a major, war-winning offensive and terminate a ground war on their own terms. As a result, the Pakistani army is increasingly relying on tactical nuclear weapons to aid their conventional forces.

    For its part, the Indian army plans to immediately take the offensive under a doctrine called “ Cold Start .” Cold Start envisions rapid mobilization followed by a major offensive into Pakistan before the country can respond with tactical nuclear weapons. Such an offensive—and Pakistan’s likely conventional defeat—could make the use of tactical nuclear weapons all the more likely.

    The adversarial relationship between India and Pakistan makes the Indian subcontinent one of the most dangerous places on Earth. The disparity in forces, war plans on both sides, and the presence of tactical nuclear weapons makes a regional nuclear war—even a limited one—a real possibility.
     
  2. Dante80

    Dante80 FULL MEMBER

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  3. Sully3

    Sully3 SENIOR MEMBER

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    it been spoken about 1000 times on this forum

    Cold start is pointless, as Pakistan will deploy the same stratergy india will.

    both countries will take over each other lands and then give it back and retreat
     
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  4. Taimur Khurram

    Taimur Khurram ELITE MEMBER

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    TL;DR:

    Nuclear holocaust, which is what I've been saying all along.
     
  5. Cash GK

    Cash GK FULL MEMBER

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    no one will win.. one think is sure next hundred years their will be no human to in both side

    no one will win.. one thing is sure next hundred years their will be no human to in both side
     
  6. maximuswarrior

    maximuswarrior ELITE MEMBER

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    The tactical weapons are from a Pakistani perspective a Godsend. The tactical weapons are giving the US and India nightmares. Ever since Pakistan introduced such weapons the enemies are dealing with headaches. These weapons have the ability to crush any hostile advancements through covert and overt means. The tactical weapons are extremely agile and mobile. The ability to move around such amazingly powerful weaponry on the battlefield is simply put mind boggling. It is such a huge benefit to deploy tactical weapons and negate the Indian numerical superiority. The Indian dream to overwhelm Pakistan through brute force has zero substance.

    Let me go as far as saying that the true deterrent that Pakistan possesses are its tactical weapons. These weapons create instant doubt and uncertainty in the minds of the enemy. The amount of paranoia that the US and India have shown for our tactical weapons speaks volumes. The Americans and Indians absolutely despise our tactical weapons capability.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
  7. M.SAAD

    M.SAAD SENIOR MEMBER

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    Nah, Indians won't do shit...


    So sit back, relax and eat cheeze :pop:
     
  8. graphican

    graphican ELITE MEMBER

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    Military analysts will go there way and I cannot comment on that - but here are Predictions of GhazwatulHind by Niamat Allah Shah Wali - some 700+ years ago.

    • As per Mahatma Gandhi, there will be 4 wars in total with 4th being India's last.
    • The war will be based on a lie.
    • First there will be a limited war in areas around Azad Kashmir, which will be result nothign. India will start full fledge war after. Every war with Pakistan will progressively kill more people than earlier one.
    • When the first limited war will start, China will start poking in areas around Tibbet. (Chicken's neck?)
    • The war will last 6 months (At another place it says 6 years)
    • As countries Turkey, Iran and Pakistan will be on one side.
    • As people, Afghan, Pakistan and Dhakni (Hyderabad Dhakan India) will be on one side (surprise no mention of Bangladesh and we all know they won't side with Pakistan today.)
    • Destruction will be devastating - there won't live a single person in 6 miles radius to light a lamp at night - (use of nuclear weapons?).
    • Pakistan will lose Lahore at first and will be pushed back upto Attak River in Khyber Pakhtonkhua, then Attak river will turn red 3 times with the blood of Indian. Pakistan will push back capturing its territory as well as Indian territory upto the area lying between two big rivers (Ganga and Yamuna - a.k.a Dehli)
    • China will join in late.
    • Indian leader will be brought in chains (looks like we are speaking of Nirandra Modi).
    • Kashmir will be liberated.

    Watch it India - Do not start a war between two Eids (Eid ul Fitar and Eid ul Idha) - as this is the war which is told to be GhazwatulHind.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2019
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  9. Mrc

    Mrc ELITE MEMBER

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    Great inaccuracies in article... If you are saying pak onky has 700 latest tanks u shud not say india has 4000... As t 72s are not even on al zarar standards..

    So in reality on t 90s matter and most of them also are without night vision... Any ways equation shud be more like 700 vs 1400 ...