• Thursday, October 18, 2018

Imran Khan, don't give your stupidity the name of humanitarianism

Discussion in 'Pakistani Siasat' started by veg, Dec 1, 2017.

  1. Haris Mansoor

    Haris Mansoor FULL MEMBER

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    Exactly, but the democracy practiced in the world is the Jewish derivative of the Islamic democracy. In Islamic democracy right for vote is not for everyone, but for only educated ones, only people educated enough who can differentiate between good and bad for the country, while in western style of democracy, an illiterate person is brought equal to the level of highest educated person. in this style a person who is mentally disturbed is equal to a genious person of high qualification,

    I will stop here, if you cannot find the true god, I don't know if you will ever follow a true leader. After knowing you lost the right path, I don't think we need to discus the right leader or someone is on right path or not.
    Feeling sorry for you.
    Just for information, is there any punishment for an ex-Muslim (Murtad) in Pakistan?
     
  2. veg

    veg BANNED

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    No. According to Pakistani law, one is allowed to leave Islam.
    These are the few modifications that State of Pakistan did to it's own Islamic State of Pakistan's Constitution, just like banning of slavery and not to invade the neighbouring Non-Muslim states for spreading Islam and to take Jizya from them.

    Alone for this Sharia Ruling, I was never comfortable with Islam, even when I was a Muslim. This is against the Divine Justice, and the Humanity within me never accepted it and always guided me against it.

    Historically speaking, although there were some oral voices, but all 4 Caliphs got the caliphate in different ways. Umer was directly appointed.
    Uthman got selected by 6 members council.
    Ali got selected as Caliph by the Killers of Uthman. Even after becoming Caliph Ali did nothing to the dead of Uthman which went on rotting for 3 days and nights in Madina. Ali (or not a single Sahabi) even washed dead body of Uthman or said prayer of Janaza. At the end, 5 people of tribe of Uthman burried him in the night. But people didn't let them bury Uthman in the graveyard of Muslims, and thus Uthman was burried in the Jewish graveyard of Hash-e-Kawkab.
    And then what Muawiyyah did to Ali, that too we all know.

    A Pakistani Hindu wrote letter to Modoodi and asked him why he wanted to implement the system of Khilafat in Pakistan, when even the Sahaba (the most pious of Muslim Generations) were themselves not able to keep the system of Khilafat-e-Rashida for more than 30 years and it ended in the bloodbath where thousands of Muslims got killed at the hands of each other.
     
  3. Haris Mansoor

    Haris Mansoor FULL MEMBER

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    very funny :p:
     
  4. veg

    veg BANNED

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    You could never understand me till the time you read with open heart all the arguments against Islam too so that you may do the comparative study.
     
  5. Haris Mansoor

    Haris Mansoor FULL MEMBER

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    Actually I did, and by the grace of Allah, found logical answers to all the question raised by non-muslims.
     
  6. SmartGeek

    SmartGeek SENIOR MEMBER

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    I disagree. Democratic voting rights is for everyone. That is how ALLAH intended the system in the first place.
    The nation can be changed from the majority, not minority. If majority are not educated, then the nation has to wait until the majority become educated to get changed. That is wills of the nation.

    During the starting Islamic period, Muslims were minority but almost all Muslims were pretty much educated [knowledge about Islam] so the lifestyle was quite conductive and easier to manage. By the time Uthman (R.A) came to rule, the situation became more complicated as more numbers added. But the millions to billions in numbers, of course it is not gonna be productive nor easier to manage in term of affair of taste.

    People want huge numbers in reverting to Islam but that also comes with the price; more people to manage at the same time which is never easy thing to do.

    The bottom line is that it has to be everyone equally. Because most of the rich people are educated, and we are seeing the result of the rich people, albeit very minority elite club, control the heavy portion of the nation including the economy along with the tax breaks which in result put more burden on the poor and middle-class people to carry the nation in terms of tax.

    The change has always been brought from the poor people's side [even from uneducated] since they are threat to the statue quo of the minority rich elite club which has everything to lose. And don't forget that Islam was brought by uneducated and unlearned man who challenged the statue quo of the rich Arab-Quresh club and ended inequality in terms of treatment, economy, relationship and more.

    There is no Apostasy law in Pakistan but there is blasphemy law which prohibits the freedom of speech/expression on the lifestyle of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) and Islam. Nothing to do with leaving Islam.

    Even in Islam, you are allowed to leave Islam if you want. No coercion in Islam whether in faith, in marriage and in general. Otherwise, those Muslims forcing you are more closer to the wrath of ALLAH than you. Because GOD gave you right to question the faith, to wonder, to think and analyze all in the name of curiosity.

    I am against blasphemy laws which also goes against the fundamental aspects of Islam - freedom of speech and expression aka anti-coercion.


    Abu Bakr (R.A) was appointed by the majority of people's votes. Normally, the original choice was Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (R.A) who was picked but he refused.

    Nearing his death, Abu Bakr (R.A) issued people to select the leadership right away so there can be no confusion. His councils said they are okay with the choice of Abu Bakr (R.A) if he has someone in sight to replace. They gave that option back to Abu Bakr (R.A) to select which then Umar Ibn Al-Kattab (R.A) was picked again. Even then, Umar Ibn Al-Kattab (R.A) refused again but Abu Bakr (R.A) would not hear it since he recommended Umar Ibn Al-Khattab (R.A) because Umar didn't want leadership. If Umar wanted the leadership, then Abu Bakr (R.A) wouldn't have recommended Umar (R.A). People who want power never have good intention. And Abu Bakr (R.A) knew that very well.

    6 members council that count the support from the region. Again, oral democracy in motion had always been.

    The history is the messy. Most of the leaders were selected through the councils/oral support. But differences among each other and the civilizations have nothing to do with the oral democracy and Islam. That difference has always been since the dawn of the mankind; politics and power. That still exists even in non-Muslim worlds.

    Even with the companionship of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH), at the end they were human beings who dealt with they were given with. And the result? That is the result of the people motivated by politics, power, misunderstanding or maybe covert operation in mission to divide and mislead. We don't know the authentic truth behind the history except of the versions which we have heard cannot be backed with the evidence. Not safe to generalize on the whole of religion based on the history which has nothing to do with the oral democracy and Islam.

    If your atheism is the result of history which to this day still plague sectarian wars, then it is poor example to pick with. Your faith should be delegated with the source of the creation which we call mankind. You need to find out why YOUR CREATOR created you even if you don't believe in. We are not here by nothingness as our times in Earth should have taught us by now that nothing is default nor made from nothingness; pizza, car, building,...etc. Pizza-makers make pizza, car-manufacturers make car, and to the extent, even mother births child with the help of the seed [father].

    If we are the sign of creations, surely that leaves the strong presence of A CREATOR. NO CREATOR - no creations. It is simple as that.

    And it is coming from former Atheist for five years questioned and drilled on this topic for years.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017
  7. Pakistansdefender

    Pakistansdefender FULL MEMBER

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    I don't know how you people think....
    When operation didn't happen, everyone was trying to do talks to taliban....
    Several government officials did many round of talks to the Taliban in fata and swat.... So why you single Imran Khan out. If some solution would come out of dialog then we have no ttp Now.... While it still exists and working as Indian proxy in Afghanistan....
    But when the state decided to do operation and kill all these scums, imran khan whole heatedly supported the operation....
    It depended on your will. A politician cannot kill terrorist....
    If the nation decides to have talks, the leader must try to facilitate it whole heatedly abd try to find a solution....
    If a nation decides to fight back, they would lead the fight and support the operation in all forms....
    Your mind just works in black and white....
    Where as real incidents are not black and white. They are shades of grey.
    To be honest it this stage of Pakistan, what is right or wrong irrespective of that, do you think at this stage it was right to touch such a sensitive topic of blasphemy or changing the oath ...? Besides the faizabad dharna can be stopped in punjab.
    It was badly managed by the government. They want to take action, but they didn't because of their vote banks....
    Imran khan can do politics in this but he didn't.... He has the right to criticize government because government handled the situation badly. The. Punjab government let them go. They are not stopped at any pointed. The operation was not planned, nothing was done right.
    So if only Imran Khan criticize the government policy. What was wrong.
    He didn't do any politics. He didn't say that they change the khatam nabowat clause or anything?

    During all those incidents, imran khan was not in power....
    Those who are in power are the ones who want talks.... Imran khan support or opposition didn't matter to them?
    Go and question them. Thousands of people have different opinion but only those incharge decides what to do ...
     
  8. Long.Live.Pakistan

    Long.Live.Pakistan FULL MEMBER

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    Imran Khan is anarchist. He is not any different than Khadim Rizvi and his supporters are actually his mureed who consider it blasphemy to criticise their pir Imran khan urff Fasadi Khan. He was going to open a office for Taliban in Islamabad and we all know he told his mureeds to go for civil disobedience. He will respect any institution of Pakistan as long as get decision or verdict as per his own wishes and expectation otherwise he will say Army cheif took BMW, Judges sold themsleves and every institution is in pocket of his opponents or every others person is corrupt except himself or those who join holy party PTI

    Parde main rehne doo parda na uthahoo warna confuse khan ka bheed khul jahey ga.. Iss U-Turn ko main kia naam doon


     
  9. Lucky Breeze

    Lucky Breeze FULL MEMBER

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    Buddy whats the need to write a whole paragraph just write "ban me". Thats it, problem solve
     
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  10. mingle

    mingle FULL MEMBER

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    They r not liberals they r pro Americans and toe theior lines for these idiots in Pak Trump is liberal too .
     
  11. ziaulislam

    ziaulislam SENIOR MEMBER

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    Isnt he now with govt
    U just mention it urself
     
  12. ziaulislam

    ziaulislam SENIOR MEMBER

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    Open up the news there are serious protests
     
  13. Kabira

    Kabira ELITE MEMBER

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    No he isn't exactly part of N league. He has his own interests and party like Achakzai. Achakzai can't but Maulana can bring more people to protest in Islamabad against merger then PTI can only dream off.
     
  14. Kabira

    Kabira ELITE MEMBER

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    Only serious protest will come from Maulana and his army of madrassa students if gov doesn't convince him before merger. You being PTIan is blinding you from facts and ground reality.