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How Urdu language was imposed on the people of Punjab by the British colonialists

jamal18

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The story I heard was that the British wanted to reduce Persian influence, which they regarded as a threat. So they banned Persian and replaced it with a language fron India called 'Urdu'.
 

Crusher

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The story I heard was that the British wanted to reduce Persian influence, which they regarded as a threat. So they banned Persian and replaced it with a language fron India called 'Urdu'.
This is indeed the truth but migrants feel threatened when one brings forth this historical truth that no area in modern Pakistan has anything to do with the development of "Urdu=Hindi" language and it was imposed on our Pakistani areas by the British colonialists post 1849 annexation of Punjab (modern KPK was part of Punjab at that time). Before that the language of education/administration in Pakistani areas was Dari Farsi, the dialect of Persian that is still used in neighboring Afghanistan and it is different than Iranian Persian Farsi dialect in some its features.
 
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Ace of Spades

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The Urdu speaking community covertly/overtly started ridiculing Punjabi as a language and started linking it with ill mannered people. While Sindhi, Pashto and baloch local languages are taught as a compulsory subject in respective provinces school, there is no where in punjab, punjabi is taught as a compulsory language in schools.
Not just urdu speakers, but you are spot on... I personally have no problem whatsoever with urdu, it's a common medium acceptable to everyone, could've had be English or Russian for that matter. Since, everyone was too suborn to adopt a local language. However, punjabi language and it's culture needs a revival. It's a wonderful language and needs to be celebrated.

Thankfully common people in punjab's cities, villages (which is majority punjab) conversate in punjabi; so all is not lost. However, this have to be taken to the school and medium of conversation and education shall be Punjabi in punjab; with urdu and english as a second language.
 

ps3linux

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Punjabis are soft speaking people,who like to mind their own business.

Urdu never threatens Punjabi citing,if closly looked it more looks like a soft persianized dialect of Punjabi.
About Punjab being invaded all the time,flat land offers economical advantage but no defence at all.That's why mostly locals would ally themselves with any attacker,that suits them.I don't think so it has been sacked by invaders,over time most invaders have lost their identities and have got assimilated themselves into Punjab and today are known as Punjabis.
Not all punjabis are some are real jerks who with their petty mindsets are nothing more than a a dark spot on the word punjabis. I guess inferiority and envy has its place.

In a way you are right for the second point. Punjab's population undoubtedly is one of the most hospitable one along our baloch and Pashtoon brothers.

@Sine Nomine I have worked out few significant dialects of punjabi, will share them tomorrow if I get time.

Thankfully common people in punjab's cities, villages (which is majority punjab) conversate in punjabi; so all is not lost. However, this have to be taken to the school and medium of conversation and education shall be Punjabi in punjab; with urdu and english as a second language.
Yaar sorry for the late reply, normally I reply within few hours unless I want someone to feel slighted deliberately because of their low quality of thought and post, not your case or that the thread has been hijacked like most of the case where the words "Punjabi" or "bengali" appear which seems to attract people with lowest IQ here on this forum . It seems the closer I am getting to our departure to U.S is coming work keeps piling up the IFRS/FATF and SECP take most of my time these days.

Nonetheless, my family business interests are spread throughout punjab and now KPK, my job with one of the largest financial firm in Pakistan and my duties as heading punjab business and now KPK, GB and AJK gives me opportunity to travel extensively these places unfortunately punjabis have started to give up on their language specially with their new generation, its not significant yet but I am afraid it will only increase.
 
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ps3linux

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Some of the significant Punjabi variants which I have experienced over the years, please feel to add more for the benefit of all:

Hindko
Kashmiri
Pahari
Potohari
Gujrat
Jhelum to Grw although Gujrat and Mandi Bahauddin is different
Sargodha-Khushab
Fsb (the variant is very close to punjabi of District Patiala)
Lahore
Okara - Sahiwal
South Punjab
Seraiki
East Punjab (Jallandhar, District Patiala, U.P, Haryana, Bhattiana - Rajhastani mix and Delhi)
 

Crusher

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Some of the significant Punjabi variants which I have experienced over the years, please feel to add more for the benefit of all:

Hindko
Kashmiri
Pahari
Potohari
Gujrat
Jhelum to Grw although Gujrat and Mandi Bahauddin is different
Sargodha-Khushab
Fsb (the variant is very close to punjabi of District Patiala)
Lahore
Okara - Sahiwal
South Punjab
Seraiki
East Punjab (Jallandhar, District Patiala, U.P, Haryana, Bhattiana - Rajhastani mix and Delhi)
This is the real and ONLY language called Kashmiri Language, can you please tell me from which angle did you "experience" it as a variant of Punjabi language,


And the closest language to Kashmiri language outside of Kashmir is the Shina particularly the dialect of Shina spoken in some parts of Kohistan region in Pakistan, this one

 
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Sheikh Rauf

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I find it funny actually. In another thread, Pakistanis are saying how Urdu is great and over here you are saying Urdu should not have been national language of Pakistan. Just reinforces my opinion that there is a lot of confusion in Pakistan as compared to India.
You have to use brain but oh well i help you out here since you guys got everything small... Urdu is great with awesome vocabulary beautiful grammer and wonderful alphabets but we need any other language which kept us away from India. so arabic farsi or turkish was choice but chosing urdu was mistake means nothing wrong with language its has to do with india.
 

Jaggu

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The Sikhs had been marginalized by the Muslim administration from the 18th century onwards. Singh Sabha literature is full of anti –Muslim rhetoric with Muslims represented as the dangerous others.

The “Chaupa Singh Rahit Nama” translated by McLeod (1987), explicitly details the anti-Muslim theme. The Sikhs are ordered:

“Never associate with a Muslim nor trust his word.
Never drink water from a Muslim’s hands, never eat his food,
And never sleep in his company.
Do not be influenced by anything which a Muslim may say,
Never touch a Muslim woman.
Never eat meat from animals killed according to Muslim rites”
This quote is taken out of historical context. It was written during the 1700s at a time when Sikhs were in a state of war with the Mughals. The original Gurmukhi text says Turk not Muslim as the translator has written. since Mughals were called Turks in old Sikh literature.

And I have read literature written during the Singh Sabha movement by scholars like Giani Ditt Singh. I have yet to see any anti Muslim sentiment from their words. If any thing Singh Sabha literature is Anti Hindu because a Hindu movement very popular in Punjab at the time called Arya Samaj was targeting Sikhs for mass conversions. This is actually the point in history when Sikh-Hindu antagonism and rivalry in Punjab started. And it also resulted in linguistic rivalry between Punjabi and Hindi. The Punjabi Hindus under the influence of Arya Samaj began advocating Hindi to be promoted as they saw this language as the symbol of the resurgence of there religion and also because their leader Dayanand Saraswati who started Arya Samaj also wrote in Hindi.

The Punjabi Muslims in response to attacks by Arya Samajis on Islam and Urdu began promoting Urdu. The Sikhs naturally saw themselves as the saviors of the Punjabi language. That is why all Sikh literature of that time (late 1800s and early 1900s) began to write literature and poetry in Punjabi of the Majhi dialect. Bhai Vir Singh who was a contemporary of Iqbal wrote so much Punjabi literature that he began to be called the 6th river of Punjab.

I read once that one of the main reasons why Sikhs did not join Pakistan and rather joined India during partition was the Punjabi language. One of the conditions of the Sikhs to join Pakistan was the recognition and promotion of the Punjabi language in a united Punjab state as a regional language which was not agreed upon by the Muslim league.

All the early Punjabi literature was written by Muslim saints. I have a whole collection of such literature in my personal library. So much of it was written in the form of Qissas/Qaseedas very beautifully in Punjabi words no longer used colloquially.
 

niaz

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This quote is taken out of historical context. It was written during the 1700s at a time when Sikhs were in a state of war with the Mughals. The original Gurmukhi text says Turk not Muslim as the translator has written. since Mughals were called Turks in old Sikh literature.

And I have read literature written during the Singh Sabha movement by scholars like Giani Ditt Singh. I have yet to see any anti-Muslim sentiment from their words. If any thing Singh Sabha literature is Anti Hindu because a Hindu movement very popular in Punjab at the time called Arya Samaj was targeting Sikhs for mass conversions. This is actually the point in history when Sikh-Hindu antagonism and rivalry in Punjab started. And it also resulted in linguistic rivalry between Punjabi and Hindi. The Punjabi Hindus under the influence of Arya Samaj began advocating Hindi to be promoted as they saw this language as the symbol of the resurgence of there religion and also because their leader Dayanand Saraswati who started Arya Samaj also wrote in Hindi.

The Punjabi Muslims in response to attacks by Arya Samajis on Islam and Urdu began promoting Urdu. The Sikhs naturally saw themselves as the saviors of the Punjabi language. That is why all Sikh literature of that time (late 1800s and early 1900s) began to write literature and poetry in Punjabi of the Majhi dialect. Bhai Vir Singh who was a contemporary of Iqbal wrote so much Punjabi literature that he began to be called the 6th river of Punjab.

I read once that one of the main reasons why Sikhs did not join Pakistan and rather joined India during partition was the Punjabi language. One of the conditions of the Sikhs to join Pakistan was the recognition and promotion of the Punjabi language in a united Punjab state as a regional language which was not agreed upon by the Muslim league.

All the early Punjabi literature was written by Muslim saints. I have a whole collection of such literature in my personal library. So much of it was written in the form of Qissas/Qaseedas very beautifully in Punjabi words no longer used colloquially.
Honorable Jaggu,

I have to believe you because I am ignorant of the Gurmukhi script. I have not had the pleasure of reading any Sikh literature except in its English translation. I am also aware of the strong Hindu bias by the Arya Samaj movement. In my view, the primary reason for the Two-Nation theory was the fear of Hindu nationalists such as RSS overwhelming the Muslim minority in a United India.

I also love Punjabi poetry and have kalam of Baba Bulleh Shah, Heer by Waris Shah and poetry by Khwaja Ghulam Farid in my collection. I am also a great fan of the 'Mahiya', Amrita Preetam and the funny verses by Imam Din. You would have noticed that Sufi kalam was originally written in the Arabic/Persian script. Even The Chachnama, one of the oldest books of the Sindhi available today was written in the script derived from Arabic. Hence it would not have been possible to accept Hindi or Punjabi written in the Nagari script by the Muslims of Punjab.

I never have and would never say that one language is better than others because everyone loves their mother tongue.

I simply maintain that Urdu is not a foreign language like English and has always been traditionally associated with the Muslims, including the Punjabis and because of the famous Punjabi writers/poets such as Iqbal, Manto, Krishan Chandar, Abdul Majid Salik, Faiz, Agha Shorish Kashmiri, Imtiaz Ali Taj, etc, Urdu was more prevalent in the Punjabi urban population than Farsi or English. Therefore the adoption of Urdu as the official language of Punjab.

I grew up in a rural environment and can vouch that Punjabi is also thriving in Pakistani Punjab. In my time there used to a Cattle Fair in Sargodha called 'Maila aspaan was muwaishian' in Spring and one could enjoy Punjabi folk music, recitals of Punjabi Sufi poetry and also Punjabi theatre including the shows by 'Bhaands'. One can even complete a BA degree thru passing the 'Punjabi Fazil' and then clearing the English BA exam. Hence I do not buy the diatribe that there has been an injustice to Punjabi in Pakistan.
 
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Taimoor Khan

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Morons.

Take Urdu out, you all will go into mute.

How Punjabis going to communicate with Pakhtoon, Sindhi, Baluchi and all other ethinicities and vice versa? Ever thought about that? They dont speak your language and you don't speak theirs.

Urdu is the medium which connect us, as one nation. These fking sub nationalist morons need to be weeded out of our society.
 
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Crusher

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..................

The Punjabi Muslims in response to attacks by Arya Samajis on Islam and Urdu began promoting Urdu. The Sikhs naturally saw themselves as the saviors of the Punjabi language. That is why all Sikh literature of that time (late 1800s and early 1900s) began to write literature and poetry in Punjabi of the Majhi dialect. Bhai Vir Singh who was a contemporary of Iqbal wrote so much Punjabi literature that he began to be called the 6th river of Punjab.

I read once that one of the main reasons why Sikhs did not join Pakistan and rather joined India during partition was the Punjabi language. One of the conditions of the Sikhs to join Pakistan was the recognition and promotion of the Punjabi language in a united Punjab state as a regional language which was not agreed upon by the Muslim league.

All the early Punjabi literature was written by Muslim saints. I have a whole collection of such literature in my personal library. So much of it was written in the form of Qissas/Qaseedas very beautifully in Punjabi words no longer used colloquially.
The Muslims of Punjab have nothing to do with "promotion" of Urdu in Punjab, it was done by the British authorities that was ruling Punjab post 1949 annexation of Punjab by the British as is evident from the opening post. The cultural language of educated Muslims of Punjab has always been "Dari" dialect of Farsi/Persian, that is the language in which our ancestors expressed themselves, learned knowledge from books of Saadi, Hafiz and Rumi etc. All our religious texts written by our ancestors in Punjab were also in Dari Farsi, British f***** up the glorious history and cultural achievements of Muslims of Punjab by abolishing the use of Dari/Farsi post 1949, we Muslims of Punjab have suffered the most under the British d0gs.
 
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You have to use brain but oh well i help you out here since you guys got everything small... Urdu is great with awesome vocabulary beautiful grammer and wonderful alphabets but we need any other language which kept us away from India. so arabic farsi or turkish was choice but chosing urdu was mistake means nothing wrong with language its has to do with india.
Then ins't that bad? Instead of looking at the language, you are looking at things that are distancing yourselves from India. I feel Pakistan policies should not always be keeping India in mind. But anyway it's your country so do as you wish.
 

Sheikh Rauf

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The story I heard was that the British wanted to reduce Persian influence, which they regarded as a threat. So they banned Persian and replaced it with a language fron India called 'Urdu'.
No urdu was formed before british came and urdu was official everywhere in subconginent.
Muslim were not into persian or arabic thats why they lost its grip in subcontinent.
 

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