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HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions-[Thread 2]

Arulmozhi Varman

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Airforce wants HAL to focus on 5th Gen AMCA and deliver it as soon as possible.
So there is a possibility that India would buy more Rafale and move on to AMCA rather than LCAmk2.
Lol no. One Amca would cost double of a Mk2. Our squadron strength is failing. You can't dispatch an Amca to every minor operations like reconnaissance, flight scare etc.
Plus Mk2 prototype are sanctioned by GoI. Cockpit, mission computer, FCS has been done including radar. Metal cutting has started. They already received landing gear from a component maker.
 

Suriya

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Lol no. One Amca would cost double of a Mk2. Our squadron strength is failing. You can't dispatch an Amca to every minor operations like reconnaissance, flight scare etc.
Plus Mk2 prototype are sanctioned by GoI. Cockpit, mission computer, FCS has been done including radar. Metal cutting has started. They already received landing gear from a component maker.
Making prototypes and getting orders from IAF is different.
Navy prototypes is flying, though NAVY has made it clear they wont buy single engine jet. So as I said there is speculation IAF may skip Mk2 and go for AMCA
 

MirageBlue

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All this is good. But why is reluctance from IAF to purchase LCA in large numbers? Like why should parkkar "convince" them?
Many reasons why. Over-promised due to a lack of understanding of how complex the development would be and then the resultant schedule lapses.

The problem has always been about where to draw the line between developing technology entirely within India and where to take an off the shelf item or get it developed by another firm outside India.

The scientific community wanted maximum technology to be developed within India, even if it meant it would take longer for the production Tejas to be ready. But the IAF wanted the opposite because it wanted to retire MiG-21s and it's force structure was being effected as a result.

In some cases, indigenous development failed to deliver the goods fully. Case in point - the Kaveri GTX-35VS turbofan. Anyone who knows fighters and aerospace knows that turbofans are the most complex piece of engineering equipment on a flying machine. And even though GTRE had built turbojets, the Kaveri was a very risky decision. After all how many countries in the world in the 1990s had the capability to design and develop a modern military turbofan engine? the IAF was rightly skeptical that it would fail and the Tejas would not meet schedules as a result. Plus, the budgets given to GTRE for the entire program was not even 10% of what GE or RR or Safran spent on a new turbofan.

Eventually, after a lot of delays, the Kaveri engine achieved the targeted dry thrust, but GTRE and DRDO encountered technical challenges that could not be overcome due to metallurgical issues and others. Eventually, only after the decision was taken to de-link the Kaveri from the Tejas program, then the Tejas program became fully viable.

Anyway there is a lot that can be written about the relationship between DRDO and the IAF on this program but all that is in the past now. As things stand the IAF has firm orders for 123 Tejas Mk1 and Mk1A fighters and the reports from the IAF are glowing for the Tejas in every way. So as things stand, the IAF would like to get as many Tejas Mk1 and Mk1As as fast as possible.
 

Joe Shearer

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@Joe Shearer You can dispel the doubt raised above, since If I remember correctly u have talked it once.
I am not sure what you want me to respond to.
First, our engineers were locked out of the Lockheed Martin offices overnight, once the embargo was imposed; they were not allowed even to retrieve their own notes and workings.
It is possible that, being competent engineers, they recalled the broad outlines of what they had been doing, reaped the benefit of eliminating blind alleys in their previous work (always happens in a development project that the second time around, one goes straight to the mark), and wrote better control laws.
As far as scoffing about claims made, claims are just claims, and so, too, scoffing is just scoffing: both are irrelevant displays born out of an inferiority complex.
As far as the analysis of the current state of play within Pakistan is concerned, two comments are possible:
  1. In the science-hostile environment that is rapidly coming to a head in Pakistan, very little progress can be expected;
  2. In emulating the blind prejudice of our neighbours and their vulnerability to religious rage, we are doing no better and already the effects are showing up.
Nothing much to choose between the two failing states.
You are way beyond stupid you if think BA or any other aerospace companies would let their FCS or FBW code to third party companies. But of course this is pdf and we have lots of idiots. Their their core engineering software. Or heart of control systems.

HCL has a huge clientale which also includes Airbus in their Bangalore and Chennai campus. The testing is performed there not development of the core software.
Other development takes place includes software hardware implementation of test fixtures for various electronic boards and parts.
This is not entirely correct. HCL picked up key people from my team after I had left, people whom I had procured salaries better than my own, and what these people were doing in our organisation was not testing work.
For instance, the control laws for one of the key ISRO launch vehicles was worked out by us; this was the first and last time ISRO outsourced this kind of work, and the ISRO chief who took over soon after this (a well-known and publicity-loving figure) made sure we got nothing from them. However, we had the capability and exercised it successfully in a number of projects that obviously may not be mentioned.
We did do a lot of testing, as it happens. One well-fed cash cow was the testing of Ada based software for Westinghouse, developed by our clients, and tested entirely by us; our certification was accepted by the end-client. That does not mean that we had no other work.
 
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Sine Nomine

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  1. rapidly coming to a head in Pakistan, very little progress can be expected;
  2. In emulating the blind prejudice of our neighbours and their vulnerability to religious rage, we are doing no better and already the effects are showing up.
1-Religion has nothing to do with progress of science in Pakistan,it's just "ratta mar babus" controlling everything and "primary fail" netas riding their shoulders holding everything back,on top of that there is corruption and shortage of funds tbh we are doing better than Bharat with little funds we have.
2-That wave would pass just try to compare it's timeline with our's,it started and eventually is dying in case of India,it is going to hit peak faster than Pakistan(thanks to new mediums of reaching masses) and would than die off slowly and you know what was sitution in Pakistan when it reached peak.

P.S:-How's your health?
Nothing much to choose between the two failing states.
Sadely,a chance after 1000 years to rule ourselves is going to be wasted due to cunning and rent seeking nature of our peoples.
 

MirageBlue

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Updates on the Uttam AESA radar for the Tejas Mk1A. From the 16th Tejas Mk1A onwards, the Elta 2052 will be replaced by the Uttam AESA.

link

Project director D Seshagiri of Electronics and Radar Development Establishment (LRDE) confirmed this and said that the developed AESA radar is 95% indigenous, with only one imported subsystem.

Later this month, the Indian Air Force (IAF) will demonstrate the use of an indigenously developed active electronically scanned array (AESA) radar, making India one of the few countries to have an indigenous force-multiplier that lies at the heart of electronic warfare, long-range missiles, and long-distance, precision-guided ammunition.

Project director D Seshagiri of Electronics and Radar Development Establishment (LRDE) confirmed this and said that the developed AESA radar is 95% indigenous, with only one imported subsystem. It has the capacity to track 50 targets in the sky at a range in excess of 100km and engage four of them simultaneously.
 

Joe Shearer

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1-Religion has nothing to do with progress of science in Pakistan,it's just "ratta mar babus" controlling everything and "primary fail" netas riding their shoulders holding everything back,on top of that there is corruption and shortage of funds tbh we are doing better than Bharat with little funds we have.
2-That wave would pass just try to compare it's timeline with our's,it started and eventually is dying in case of India,it is going to hit peak faster than Pakistan(thanks to new mediums of reaching masses) and would than die off slowly and you know what was sitution in Pakistan when it reached peak.

P.S:-How's your health?

Sadely,a chance after 1000 years to rule ourselves is going to be wasted due to cunning and rent seeking nature of our peoples.
I think you got that right.
 

Arulmozhi Varman

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I am not sure what you want me to respond to.
First, our engineers were locked out of the Lockheed Martin offices overnight, once the embargo was imposed; they were not allowed even to retrieve their own notes and workings.
It is possible that, being competent engineers, they recalled the broad outlines of what they had been doing, reaped the benefit of eliminating blind alleys in their previous work (always happens in a development project that the second time around, one goes straight to the mark), and wrote better control laws.
As far as scoffing about claims made, claims are just claims, and so, too, scoffing is just scoffing: both are irrelevant displays born out of an inferiority complex.
As far as the analysis of the current state of play within Pakistan is concerned, two comments are possible:
  1. In the science-hostile environment that is rapidly coming to a head in Pakistan, very little progress can be expected;
  2. In emulating the blind prejudice of our neighbours and their vulnerability to religious rage, we are doing no better and already the effects are showing up.
Nothing much to choose between the two failing states.


This is not entirely correct. HCL picked up key people from my team after I had left, people whom I had procured salaries better than my own, and what these people were doing in our organisation was not testing work.
For instance, the control laws for one of the key ISRO launch vehicles was worked out by us; this was the first and last time ISRO outsourced this kind of work, and the ISRO chief who took over soon after this (a well-known and publicity-loving figure) made sure we got nothing from them. However, we had the capability and exercised it successfully in a number of projects that obviously may not be mentioned.
We did do a lot of testing, as it happens. One well-fed cash cow was the testing of Ada based software for Westinghouse, developed by our clients, and tested entirely by us; our certification was accepted by the end-client. That does not mean that we had no other work.
I might be wrong. But my friend is currently working in a HCL campus in Chennai related to Airbus. And I do know they had a team for Boeing though I do not know anyone from the team. He is not an firmware engineer or software engineer, but worked on Electronics, simulation and avionics test fixtures.
Being myself a ATE engineer, I have quite a lot of contacts in the field.
But I am pretty surprised you worked in technical field. I thought you were a bureaucrat. :D
 

Joe Shearer

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I might be wrong. But my friend is currently working in a HCL campus in Chennai related to Airbus. And I do know they had a team for Boeing though I do not know anyone from the team. He is not an firmware engineer or software engineer, but worked on Electronics, simulation and avionics test fixtures.
Being myself a ATE engineer, I have quite a lot of contacts in the field.
But I am pretty surprised you worked in technical field. I thought you were a bureaucrat. :D
I did neither. Read my post carefully.
 

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