What's new

HAL Tejas | Updates, News & Discussions-[Thread 2]

ziaulislam

ELITE MEMBER
Apr 22, 2010
14,426
10
13,523
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
Reasons why LCA will never be exported

1) Lack of enthusiasm by IAF, even if they order 83 LCA it pretty much seems it is being forced on them
2) US Engine will need US permission
3) Strange mix of weapons (mainly Israeli/Indian) that are not in service in 99% of countries
4) Price, seems to go up or down depending on HAL, also 2 JF-17s can be purchased for 1 LCA
5) Training, does India have training infrastructure to train/convert pilots on LCA? No two seaters yet
6) Not combat proven


Now look at JF-17

1) PAF fully behind all blocks, in 8 PAF squadrons, Nigerian AF, Myanmar AF
2) Chinese or Russian engine, usually no export controls
3) Can use Chinese, US, Pakistani, Brazilian missiles
4) Price very competative, China will even give loan guarantees
5) PAF Has vast training infrastucture with 1 squadron dedicated to conversion and 26 two seater produced, can easily handle foreign training like we did for Nigeria
6) Saw combat against India
reason why it may be exported
  1. good financing made by india available
  2. western countries which have good acess to usa weapons but for some weird reasons will not be able to get gripen NG, used f16s or f16s (all of whom are similar priced and light years ahead)
 

Yasser76

FULL MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
1,587
1
2,401
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
reason why it may be exported
  1. good financing made by india available
  2. western countries which have good acess to usa weapons but for some weird reasons will not be able to get gripen NG, used f16s or f16s (all of whom are similar priced and light years ahead)
reason why it may be exported
  1. good financing made by india available
  2. western countries which have good acess to usa weapons but for some weird reasons will not be able to get gripen NG, used f16s or f16s (all of whom are similar priced and light years ahead)

I disagree, in current situation India having trouble evening financing it's own deals.
LCA not integrated with any US or European weapons
 

ziaulislam

ELITE MEMBER
Apr 22, 2010
14,426
10
13,523
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
I disagree, in current situation India having trouble evening financing it's own deals.
LCA not integrated with any US or European weapons
they are pushing it to bengladesh and srilanka
if india provides a billion dollars of credit to each with zero interest rate then each may buy 12 aircrafts and if America clears it and Israelis' are okay and France and Germans are okay lol
 

Yasser76

FULL MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
1,587
1
2,401
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
they are pushing it to bengladesh and srilanka
if india provides a billion dollars of credit to each with zero interest rate then each may buy 12 aircrafts and if America clears it and Israelis' are okay and France and Germans are okay lol

Hahahaha, yes good point, they will need a lot of OKs! Sri Lanka has no love for India
 

MirageBlue

FULL MEMBER
Mar 24, 2020
320
1
608
Country
United States
Location
India
Here's a brochure for the Elta EL 8212/8222 Wide Band EW jammer pod that will be a key part of the EW suite of the Tejas Mk1A. It is already integrated with the Elta 2052 AESA radar, being a product of the same company. One damn good piece of EW Self protection jammer kit.

EL 8212/8222 WB SPJ
 

Path-Finder

ELITE MEMBER
Feb 7, 2013
19,776
1
28,613
Country
Pakistan
Location
United Kingdom
As such I have in all honest nothing against "all Indian", but I have issues with showing off and boaster, especially since others are made responsible for everything and every failure simply because you started with an unrealistic approach. And so back to the topic: With everything I know and have learned in recent years, it is illusory to assume that HAL / ADA or whoever will successfully complete the Tejas Mk.1A, Tejas Mk.2, TEDBF / ORCA and AMCA by 2026 or 2030. And that's not because I wouldn't grant India anything, but simply the experience with the LCA program, the HJT-36, ... and much more.
NEIN, Sie wagen es, die Überlegenheit der vedischen Technologie zu leugnen :pissed:
 

MirageBlue

FULL MEMBER
Mar 24, 2020
320
1
608
Country
United States
Location
India
Some more updates from Dr Girish Deodhare, ADA Director

On the indigenous Uttam AESA radar:
  • Currently flying on 2 Tejas LSP prototypes and being tested by the IAF
  • Doing very well in flight tests
  • Expected to be integrated with the Tejas Mk1A soon
  • Radar testing is a long process
  • Plan is to use the Elta 2052 for the first few Tejas Mk1A, then the Uttam AESA radar will be used after it is ready
  • For Tejas Mk2 and AMCA, only upgraded versions of Uttam AESA radar are being considered, no imported AESA radars
  • Tejas Mk2 will have an indigenous upgraded Uttam AESA radar derivative with more T/W elements due to larger radome aperture
  • For AMCA, the upgraded Uttam AESA radar derivative will also have to support stealth features
  • All of these developments are happening concurrently at LRDE, the DRDO lab responsible for the AESA radar development
 

Yasser76

FULL MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
1,587
1
2,401
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
Some more updates from Dr Girish Deodhare, ADA Director

On the indigenous Uttam AESA radar:
  • Currently flying on 2 Tejas LSP prototypes and being tested by the IAF
  • Doing very well in flight tests
  • Expected to be integrated with the Tejas Mk1A soon
  • Radar testing is a long process
  • Plan is to use the Elta 2052 for the first few Tejas Mk1A, then the Uttam AESA radar will be used after it is ready
  • For Tejas Mk2 and AMCA, only upgraded versions of Uttam AESA radar are being considered, no imported AESA radars
  • Tejas Mk2 will have an indigenous upgraded Uttam AESA radar derivative with more T/W elements due to larger radome aperture
  • For AMCA, the upgraded Uttam AESA radar derivative will also have to support stealth features
  • All of these developments are happening concurrently at LRDE, the DRDO lab responsible for the AESA radar development
"

  • Expected to be integrated with the Tejas Mk1A soon"

How is this possible if HAL have actually stated that they need this year to deliver the MK1s on order and first MK1A will not be ready by 2023? HAL actually contradicting itself?
 

MirageBlue

FULL MEMBER
Mar 24, 2020
320
1
608
Country
United States
Location
India
Tejas SP23 just had it's first flight today.

Twitter link

Tejas #SP23 completes successful first flight. Piloted by HAL TP Gp Capt Rajeev Joshi (Retd). Will update if anything interesting further.
"

  • Expected to be integrated with the Tejas Mk1A soon"

How is this possible if HAL have actually stated that they need this year to deliver the MK1s on order and first MK1A will not be ready by 2023? HAL actually contradicting itself?
Tejas Mk1A prototype is basically modified Tejas Mk1 LSP, not new build prototypes.

Uttam is already flying on Tejas Mk1 LSPs for full qualification of the radar in air to air, air to ground and air to sea modes. It should be integrated with another prototype ear-marked as a Mk1A prototype once the flight tests on the other 2 LSPs is completed.
 

Yasser76

FULL MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
1,587
1
2,401
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
Tejas SP23 just had it's first flight today.

Twitter link




Tejas Mk1A prototype is basically modified Tejas Mk1 LSP, not new build prototypes.

Uttam is already flying on Tejas Mk1 LSPs for full qualification of the radar in air to air, air to ground and air to sea modes. It should be integrated with another prototype ear-marked as a Mk1A prototype once the flight tests on the other 2 LSPs is completed.

I am confused. Is HAL Building a MK1A prototype than along with trying to fill the current MK1 order? So you are claiming MK1A is flying (as MK1 LSP)? Thats pretty big news, you better tell HAL and IAF, quickly....

Or maybe this is all just more BS that HAL comes out with on a regular basis?

For someone constantly stressing the need for factual posts, you fall well below your own standard....
 

ziaulislam

ELITE MEMBER
Apr 22, 2010
14,426
10
13,523
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
I am confused. Is HAL Building a MK1A prototype than along with trying to fill the current MK1 order? So you are claiming MK1A is flying (as MK1 LSP)? Thats pretty big news, you better tell HAL and IAF, quickly....

Or maybe this is all just more BS that HAL comes out with on a regular basis?

For someone constantly stressing the need for factual posts, you fall well below your own standard....
Plan is to build mk1a till 2030(124 order)
Get a prototype following for mk2(a new fighter) by 2023 and get all certifications done by 2030/ serial production by 2030
With plan to induct after 2030

This mk2 will replace the aging migs after 2030 and mirages after 2040
OCRA will be pitched to the navy and if navy says yes will be built by 2025 with serial production by 2032-35
So basically HAL intends to
1. Develop AMCA by god knows when(2026 prototype?!!)
2. Devleop mk2 MWF by 2030 prototype by 2023
3. Develop OCRA heavy fightet if yes by navy for the navy
4. Develop the SMART TRAINER.
5. Built mk1a (100+ pending)
6. Integrate indegionous radar for mk2 & engine for AMCA

in nutshell HAL is pitching it can do more in next 10 years then what it has done in last 70 years
That is to develop 4 new fighters and serial produce 1 of them
Even china with several of its aviation branches couldnt do this but indians are trying..let see what happens

Atleast CGIs are all done
 
Last edited:

Yasser76

FULL MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
1,587
1
2,401
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
Plan is to build mk1a till 2030(124 order)
Get a prototype following for mk2(a new fighter) by 2023 and get all certifications done by 2030/ serial production by 2030
With plan to induct after 2030

This mk2 will replace the aging migs after 2030 and mirages after 2040
OCRA will be pitched to the navy and if navy says yes will be built by 2025 with serial production by 2032-35
So basically HAL intends to
1. Develop AMCA by god knows when(2030)
2. Devleop mk2 MWF by 2030 prototype by 2023
3. Develop OCRA heavy fightet if yes by navy for the navy
4. Develop the SMART TRAINER.
5. Built mk1a (100+ pending)
6. Integrate indegionous radar for mk2 & engine for AMCA

in nutshell HAL is pitching it can do more in next 10 years then what it has done in last 70 years
That is to develop 4 new fighters and serial produce 1 of them
Even china with several of its aviation branches couldnt do this but indians are trying..let see what happens

Atleast CGIs are all done

Yeah, just wanted to pick him up on Uttam suddenly being integrated in a plane that does not exist. As usual he has done a dissapearing act when questioned....
 

ziaulislam

ELITE MEMBER
Apr 22, 2010
14,426
10
13,523
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
Yeah, just wanted to pick him up on Uttam suddenly being integrated in a plane that does not exist. As usual he has done a dissapearing act when questioned....
Plan is ambitious but impossible
If india does it i will consider india as world leader in avaition as noone has done this before
To build 4 new jets within 6 years not even china

For now it seems india is well behind in LCA production and meeting 2030 deadline for 123 is not possible with CURRENT RATE

But will india be able to make the MWF(Mk2), OCRA, SMART LCA, AMCA all by 2026..well we will have to wait
 

Yasser76

FULL MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
1,587
1
2,401
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
Plan is ambitious but impossible
If india does it i will consider india as world leader in avaition as noone has done this before
To build 4 new jets within 6 years not even china

For now it seems india is well behind in LCA production and meeting 2030 deadline for 123 is not possible with CURRENT RATE

But will india be able to make the MWF(Mk2), OCRA, SMART LCA, AMCA all by 2026..well we will have to wait

It's actually good for us that they feed their masses this BS. Means they will never have a real onus to try and really achieve anything.

Sweden with population of 10 million made a jet quickly with US engine, sold it to 6 countries. First flight was in 1989, first batch of 110 planes ordered in 1992, first full combat squadron First full combat squadron in 1997.

Now compare that with India (who had Swedish and French help and learnings). First LCA flight in 2001. It is no 2021 and they do not have a full combat capable squadron (just IOC squadron).

That is how bad this programme is
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 2, Members: 0, Guests: 2)


Top Bottom