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Greece seeks to join F-35 program as it lobbies against Turkey F-16 sale

EAGLE777

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For every turkish forumer, Turkey is best in all fields. So nothing new.

But it remains clear that the industrial power of Turkey is bigger than those of Greece, and are quite impressive in some area. See the commercial and tactical success of turkish UAV.


So explain me why, after 80 days of heavy battle, there remain ukrainian old style fighters (versus newer F16-70 or Rafale) in the ukrainian sky over the battle field ?
Where are the russians Mig 31 and S400? Maybe they are not efficient as intended.
You are from France if you or someone from Canada or USA would criticise or even belittle Turkeys economy i would still understand but here we have Greeks, Iranians etc people far behind us talking arrogantly trying to troll about our economy that is pissing me off.

From İzmir ( Turkiye ) to Athens ( Greece ) = 300 km
From Donetsk to Lviv in Ukraine = 1.000 - 1.200 km

so S400s can block Aegean Sea against Greek Rafales and F-16Vs
S400s can lock on Greek Rafales and F-16Vs even over Greek Airspace


btw if Turkiye fires 1.000 BORA , J600T , ATACMS ,SOM , ATMACA , SLAM-ER , GEZGIN , HARM , KUZGUN-TJ , TRLG-230 ,CAKIR Missiles , then no more Air Bases - Jet Hangars , Air Defense Systems in Greece and Greek Islands
Broski uyuyanları uyandırma
 

Foinikas

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but since 2013 there was economic-asymmetric war between Turkiye and USA-France-PKK/YPG , FETO , HAFTAR , Greece , Armenia , etc in İraq,Syria,Libya,Qatar,Azerbaijan and in the Eastern Mediterranean
Ah yes,let's blame it on assymetric warfare by everybody else,not Erdogan's policies :P

btw if Turkiye fires 1.000 BORA , J600T , ATACMS ,SOM , ATMACA , SLAM-ER , GEZGIN , HARM , KUZGUN-TJ , TRLG-230 ,CAKIR Missiles , then no more Air Bases - Jet Hangars , Air Defense Systems in Greece and Greek Islands
We've heard that like 100 times already from you. That's a lot of talk about a lot of systems. You think that:

1.Greece doesn't have AA systems
2.You have enough missiles
3.HAF doesn't have reinforced hangars
4.Greece cannot retaliate

The thing is that we have 6 Rafale and by the end of the year we will be getting 6 more and 8-9 F-16Vs.

What do you have? Future projects.

but here we have Greeks, Iranians etc people far behind us talking arrogantly trying to troll about our economy that is pissing me off.
Yes but you have to understand,you have been trolling our economies for 10 years. That wasn't so nice.
 
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jamahir

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Turkiye has enough money to spend even $100 billion for humanitarian aid to other countries
and for military operations in İraq,Syria,Libya,Qatar,Somalia,Azerbaijan

You mean Erdogan's terrorist / criminal / genocidal / war-crime operations in Libya and Syria in support of Al Qaeda and "Muslim" Brotherhood ?
 

MMM-E

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The thing is that we have 6 Rafale and by the end of the year we will be getting 6 more and 8-9 F-16Vs.

What do you have? Future projects.

We have already S400s that can turn your Rafales and F-16s into crap of metal

also TURAF has 230+ F-16s .. 6 Rafales can not change anything
 

Nuclear Clown

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Congratz, GREECE! Already a potent air force will be even more powerful with Rafales and F-35s and Vipers!
You need neither Viper nor F-35 when you have Rafale, especially the F4 upgrade which introduces 3rd gen stealth, BTW, Rafale's systems can be used as drop-ins for Mirage-2000. Safran has already shown a 100kN non-afterburner version of the M88 and they say they can deliver a 115kN/afterburner one under 18 months... Since the 3rd gen stealth can be applied to anything, that the M88 is so small you may add about 1000L more internal fuel, they could e.g. sell their F-16s to Turkey, get all the Mirage-2000s retired by France and others, refurbish them, and, since Rafale's hourly cost is the half of F-16, the M2000-NG should fly for about the quarter, actually, it'd even be feasible to make the Gripen-C or the Tejas more capable than a Mirage-2000 or F-16 by using such versions of the M88 while Rafale F4 systems mean 5.5th generation aircraft... The money spared on cost of use would allow Greece to modernise its whole fleet without ending with their way too high 3.82% of GDP military spending for 2022! By doing so, they'd be able to modernize and stay with their usual 2.4%...
Moreover, multiple types is bad for logistics and as any EU country, it's high time to apply an EU-first policy for weaponry...
And, BTW, why don't they do like Turkey when e.g. the Su-24 violated Turkish airspace? TAF violates Greek airspace an average 8x per day... Let's them know about the MBDA Meteor, when they'll lose 8 aircraft a day, they'll soon stop : as Macron said, the only language ErdoGollum understands is force.
F-35 is a force depleter, Rafale is a force multiplier, Greece hasn't even half of Israel's GDP, they don't need a money pit like F-35...

Moreover, it's high time to start an EU nuclear sharing based on 500 ASMPA-R and also introduce the conventional version proposed by MBDA to replace the Exocet.

In fact, Rafale is exactly what USAF needs if we consider what gen Charles Q. Brown said, since F-35 will NEVER be able to replace the F-16, except he spoke about 5th gen minus, while Rafale F4 introduces the 5th gen+
 

MMM-E

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1.Greece doesn't have AA systems
2.You have enough missiles
3.HAF doesn't have reinforced hangars
4.Greece cannot retaliate

1 .. Greece has limited AA Systems .. and Greece has no technology to produce AA Systems
on the other hand Turkiye has its own technology to produce even thousands of BORA , SOM , ATMACA , KGK-LR , TRLG-230 , J600T , KARGI , KUZGUN-TJ , CAKIR and many more on the way

Greece never can stop Turkish missile fire power


2 ... Yes we have enough Missiles ...

3 ... in a war we will see your so-called reinforced hangars against Turkish Ballistic Missiles

4 ... Greece has only 50-90 SCALP Missiles .... and you can not attack on Turkish air bases in Malatya , Diyarbakır , Amasya , Konya , and many more

on the other hand TURAF has 50 SLAM-ER , 95 POPEYE , more 415 SOM
hundreds of TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , KGK-LR ,KARA-ATMACA , J600T are coming
and BORA Tactical Ballistic Missiles also GEZGIN long range Cruise Missile and RAMJET powered supersonic cruise Missile under development

if Greece fires 50 missiles , Turkiye can fire 500 missiles
 

White and Green with M/S

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1 .. Greece has limited AA Systems .. and Greece has no technology to produce AA Systems
on the other hand Turkiye has its own technology to produce even thousands of BORA , SOM , ATMACA , KGK-LR , TRLG-230 , J600T , KARGI , KUZGUN-TJ , CAKIR and many more on the way

Greece never can stop Turkish missile fire power


2 ... Yes we have enough Missiles ...

3 ... in a war we will see your so-called reinforced hangars against Turkish Ballistic Missiles

4 ... Greece has only 50-90 SCALP Missiles .... and you can not attack on Turkish air bases in Malatya , Diyarbakır , Amasya , Konya , and many more

on the other hand TURAF has 50 SLAM-ER , 95 POPEYE , more 415 SOM
hundreds of TRLG-230 , CAKIR , KUZGUN-TJ , KGK-LR ,KARA-ATMACA , J600T are coming
and BORA Tactical Ballistic Missiles also GEZGIN long range Cruise Missile and RAMJET powered supersonic cruise Missile under development

if Greece fires 50 missiles , Turkiye can fire 500 missiles
Are you Turkish salesman shit
 

MMM-E

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S-400 can be defeated with right tactic

therefore Turkish KORKUT 35mm SPAAGs and HISAR-A , HISAR-O Air Defense Systems entered service to protect S400s from Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones



btw Turkiye has Air Defense System technology called SIPER with range of 150 km to be in service by 2023

that means Turkiye join the big club ( USA , Russia , China , İsrael , France-İtaly , İran and Turkiye ) to produce its own Air Defense Systems to intercept Fighter Jets and Cruise Missiles
1653017652519.jpeg



600 km Turkish AESA Radar for SIPER Air Defense System
1653017961857.jpeg
 
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White and Green with M/S

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therefore Turkish KORKUT 35mm SPAAGs and HISAR-A , HISAR-O Air Defense Systems entered service to protect S400s from Cruise Missiles and Kamikaze Drones



btw Turkiye has Air Defense System technology called SIPER with range of 150 km to be in service by 2023

that means Turkiye join the big club ( USA , Russia , China , İsrael , France-İtaly , İran and Turkiye ) to produce its own Air Defense Systems to intercept Fighter Jets and Cruise Missiles
View attachment 845586


600 km Turkish AESA Radar for SIPER Air Defense System
View attachment 845587
Are you Turkish defense salesman?
 

Nuclear Clown

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S-400 can be defeated with right tactic
You don't even need the right tactic : Rafale F3 was already the only aircraft unharmed during NATO drills against S-300, at a point it even overflew the batteries... For S-400, especially doubled with Nebo-M based in Syria, the "red bubble" is only about 35km radius, maybe 40km... All you need is AASM HAMMER or Spice-250 (integrated on Indian request). With Rafale F4, you just need to drop a JDAM or Paveway, or you can ignore S-400 since if you demolish it, it will ring the alarms and spoil the surprise of your deep penetration attack against the enemy HQs... The Russians were unable to monitor Rafale activities over Syria despite the country is under the coverage of both the 29B6 Konteyner and the Iranian Rezonans, they were unable to detect, jam or intercept the SCALP-EG and they knew these were coming and they tried hard... So, if they couldn't do something despite S-400, S-300, Nebo-M, the Beriev A-50, Pantsir, Tore, Konteyner and Rezonans, and so was it for the Turks in al-Watiya despite Hawk-XXI (which is very good), Sentinel and the powerful Koral EW system. Aircraft with delta wings were even spotted by civilians not far from the base, so they were very close and not flying low to take profit from Earth curvature, any way, it's a flat desert all around...

What you need to do is simply keep all your systems in passive mode to avoid being spotted by some ELINT, use TALIOS to program your bomb and kaboom...
The even easier but more expensive solution is simply to launch a SCALP from 500km...
 

MMM-E

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You need neither Viper nor F-35 when you have Rafale,


Rafale is old technology and Rafale will be hunted by Turkish MIUS unmanned stealth Fighter Jet in 2025


Endurance : 5 Hours
Service ceiling : 40,000 ft
Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
Payload : 1.5 Tons

-- AESA radar and next-generation avionics, sensor fusion
-- Internal weapon stations
-- Stealth flight capability
-- The ability to hide from Radars
-- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
-- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
-- Turbofan engine
1653018559253.jpeg


what about if we are talking about BVR Combat ?

-- MIUS will have stealth capability with Internal weapon stations
-- MIUS will have AESA Radar - data link for cooperative engagement capability to use 600 km EIRS early warning AESA Radar and 450 km CAFRAD naval AESA Radar to detect Rafale or SU-35 or F-15 and to guide GOKHAN ramjet engine long range air to air missiles on Rafale or SU-35 or F-15

in BVR combat , stealth MIUS will advantage against Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15
because of 4th gen Fighter Jets with bigger RCS

If first MIUS detect the enemy Fighter Jets then press the kill button and game over


France's old technologies can not save Greece
 

White and Green with M/S

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Rafale is old technology and Rafale will be hunted by Turkish MIUS unmanned stealth Fighter Jet in 2025


Endurance : 5 Hours
Service ceiling : 40,000 ft
Cruise speed : supersonic 1,4 mach
Payload : 1.5 Tons

-- AESA radar and next-generation avionics, sensor fusion
-- Internal weapon stations
-- Stealth flight capability
-- The ability to hide from Radars
-- Aggressive maneuverability with delta canard and vertical stabilizers
-- Smart fleet autonomy equipped with artificial intelligence
-- Turbofan engine
View attachment 845589

what about if we are talking about BVR Combat ?

-- MIUS will have stealth capability with Internal weapon stations
-- MIUS will have AESA Radar - data link for cooperative engagement capability to use 600 km EIRS early warning AESA Radar and 450 km CAFRAD naval AESA Radar to detect Rafale or SU-35 or F-15 and to guide GOKHAN ramjet engine long range air to air missiles on Rafale or SU-35 or F-15

in BVR combat , stealth MIUS will advantage against Rafale , MIG-29M2 , SU-35 , F-15
because of 4th gen Fighter Jets with bigger RCS

If first MIUS detect the enemy Fighter Jets then press the kill button and game over
This is not true stealth drone 😆
 

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