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France to deliver 35 Rafales by 2021-end, a solo fighter will join in Jan 2022

safari2021

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A fully loaded Rafale fighter with Hammer, SCALP and Meteor air-to-air missile and munitions.


France will have delivered a total of 35 omni-role Rafale fighters by end-2021 to India with a last fighter making a solo journey to soon to be activated Hashimara air base in north Bengal in January 2022. Already 26 fighters have been delivered with 24 landed in India and remaining two kept for IAF pilot and technician training in France.


Given the reliability of strategic ally France, the Indian Air Force (IAF) and the Indian Navy have evinced keen interest in Rafale platform due to its weight to power ratio and maritime strike capabilities. Apparently, the IAF leadership wants to acquire another 36 Rafales in future and the Navy is looking at Rafale-M as a fighter option onboard INS Vikrant (Indigenous aircraft carrier-1), to be commissioned next year.

The induction of Rafale into western and eastern theatre has force multiplied Indian war making capabilities as the French fighter is armed with the longest range air-to-air Meteor missile in the sub-continent, Hammer air to ground smart munition and long range SCALP air to ground weapon. The Hammer missile, which has been acquired by India under emergency purchases, can be released at a height of mere 500 feet to hit a high altitude target more than 70 km away. The missile hugs the terrain and then climbs to a height of over 4000 metres before striking the target from a top down action. The Indian Rafales carry specially modified Hammer missiles due to high altitude targets, mountainous terrain and Chinese recently acquired Russian S-400 air defence systems. In fact, the French have offered to jointly develop Hammer and Meteor missiles with India with extended range and heavier payload.

While the French Rafale deliveries are slightly ahead of time, all eyes are on the activation of the Hashimara air base, which will house the second squadron of Rafale fighters with the first squadron being home based in Ambala. The presence of Rafale in India’s eastern sector will add teeth to its military response in the sector with both Sikkim and Arunachal Pradesh being a defence priority.

The positioning of Hashimara is such that it covers the Chumbi Valley, Sikkim and the sensitive Siliguri corridor. While both Ambala and Hashimara are home bases of Rafale, the fighters with nuclear capability will be flying all over India and its littoral territories.

 

Reichsmarschall

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China having spent significant amount of money into a fighter jet which it is never going to use, most probably forced Pakistan to accept its avionics to offset some of its development costs. Chinese who are known for their self reliance first and quality next, are further downgrading JF-17s capabilities with their poorly copy-pirated avionics. Along with their dubious weapons, any chance of JF-17 maintaining BVR edge over its adversary’s front-line combatants, for the most part, is unlikely.

Even in close combat JF-17 lacks what it takes to win the fight. Its spine, & wings bearing resemblance(in wing twist & wing area) to a fighter which china knows inside out, the J-7, doesn’t have wing twist nor does it have enough area to provide a low wing loading. Its performance during low speeds and high alphas would be very dangerous for the pilot indeed. It has a Maximum G loading of only 8, as claimed by PAC. Its thrust to weight ratio is another negative point. Pakistan Aeronautical Complex(PAC) proudly displays the RD-93’s “Combat thrust with afterburner” as 19,200lbf, while the whole defense community knows RD-93’s thrust is 18,300lbf and the only real thrust increase was achieved with its new re-designed Sea Wasp RD-33MK engines- which has been explicitly stated by Klimov. However, Klimov’s RD-33 series 3(or series 2), whose avatar is RD-93 with re-positioned Gear boxes, has a provision for emergency thrust which Klimov says can produce 8700kgf(~19200lbf) in their officially released document. They further state that as “Take-off emergency mode”. So the mentioned thrust can only be used during take-off where the Air is denser, and also only during emergency situations since it would seriously lower the engine’s lifespan. This is a far cry from PAC's “Combat thrust” claim. Why this is being stated is because, the engines(bought by the Chinese after pressurizing the Russians) are the only non-Chinese & non-Pakistani component, and even there they have lied about its capabilities. Hence the true, lower than published, specifications of Chinese and Pakistani components are open to any one’s guesses. In any case, the close combat capabilities of JF-17 is below average or average at best.

The next Achilles heal is JF-17’s speed. For a good interception, speed is an important criteria. However JF-17’s max speed is Mach 1.6 which is claimed by PAC. This indicates that JF-17 is draggier. When compared, their F-7s(Reverse engineered MiG-21s) have higher speed of mach 2+ with a lower thrust engine. The IAF fighters which it is going to face, all have speeds greater than the Thunder.

So why is Pakistan still inducting more and more of this fighter, which its critics increasingly call it Junk Fighter – 17 ? The answer may lie with Pakistan’s recent trauma & its psyche. Having sanctioned by the U.S, the star of their airforce, the F-16s were severally hit by lack of spares and most of the time grounded. The other 2 sources to procure modern Aircraft- Russia, have been sealed off due to the legacy of Soviet era friendship, current market in India & India’s pressure- and the other source, the European Union, for their extremely high costs. The third source, the Chinese, at that time were still flying their reverse engineered MiG-21s. In those circumstances, “Never again” was the motto of PAF and it instantly jumped into the project of further reversing the reverse engineered MiG-21, known as Super-7(a.k.a Super F-7) to obtain self reliance. The result of that project is the JF-17. So the decision was appropriate at that time, in those situations. However now with China having developed the J-10, and going by the recent reports of offering ToT(Transfer of Technology) to Pakistan, one wonders why are the Pakistanis still ordering 250 planes. Is the trauma of F-16 sanctions so high that they don’t even trust the Chinese? This can't be the case because they still need the Chinese to procure the RD-93 engines for them, even after the Chinese transfer all their associated JF-17 tech to PAC. So why...? The answer lies with their ego/psyche rather than the trauma. Unlike J-10, Pakistan shares copyright to JF-17 and that, for some weird reason, gives them something to celebrate about. This is strange for the reason, war machines are for fighting wars and achieving tactical & strategic objectives, not for gloating about who holds the copyrights. When JF-17 comes face to face with MKI or UPG, there won’t be much to celebrate about it, or the few millions if at all it earns through exports. In the end, it’s all about defending ones homeland from the enemy, and not copyrights.

JF-17 would have been the best fighter and a sensible decision in the absence of J-10, but now its reason for existence is as obsolete as the fighter itself.
Imagine being so dumb and retarded that you copy paste an 11 year old gibberish to satisfy your tiny little ego,
1628159210617.png

source of this cow shit : **** JF-17 Arrives In Farnborough - Livefist (livefistdefence.com)
@SQ8 @The Eagle can you please do the needful?
 

Trango Towers

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China having spent significant amount of money into a fighter jet which it is never going to use, most probably forced Pakistan to accept its avionics to offset some of its development costs. Chinese who are known for their self reliance first and quality next, are further downgrading JF-17s capabilities with their poorly copy-pirated avionics. Along with their dubious weapons, any chance of JF-17 maintaining BVR edge over its adversary’s front-line combatants, for the most part, is unlikely.

Even in close combat JF-17 lacks what it takes to win the fight. Its spine, & wings bearing resemblance(in wing twist & wing area) to a fighter which china knows inside out, the J-7, doesn’t have wing twist nor does it have enough area to provide a low wing loading. Its performance during low speeds and high alphas would be very dangerous for the pilot indeed. It has a Maximum G loading of only 8, as claimed by PAC. Its thrust to weight ratio is another negative point. Pakistan Aeronautical Complex(PAC) proudly displays the RD-93’s “Combat thrust with afterburner” as 19,200lbf, while the whole defense community knows RD-93’s thrust is 18,300lbf and the only real thrust increase was achieved with its new re-designed Sea Wasp RD-33MK engines- which has been explicitly stated by Klimov. However, Klimov’s RD-33 series 3(or series 2), whose avatar is RD-93 with re-positioned Gear boxes, has a provision for emergency thrust which Klimov says can produce 8700kgf(~19200lbf) in their officially released document. They further state that as “Take-off emergency mode”. So the mentioned thrust can only be used during take-off where the Air is denser, and also only during emergency situations since it would seriously lower the engine’s lifespan. This is a far cry from PAC's “Combat thrust” claim. Why this is being stated is because, the engines(bought by the Chinese after pressurizing the Russians) are the only non-Chinese & non-Pakistani component, and even there they have lied about its capabilities. Hence the true, lower than published, specifications of Chinese and Pakistani components are open to any one’s guesses. In any case, the close combat capabilities of JF-17 is below average or average at best.

The next Achilles heal is JF-17’s speed. For a good interception, speed is an important criteria. However JF-17’s max speed is Mach 1.6 which is claimed by PAC. This indicates that JF-17 is draggier. When compared, their F-7s(Reverse engineered MiG-21s) have higher speed of mach 2+ with a lower thrust engine. The IAF fighters which it is going to face, all have speeds greater than the Thunder.

So why is Pakistan still inducting more and more of this fighter, which its critics increasingly call it Junk Fighter – 17 ? The answer may lie with Pakistan’s recent trauma & its psyche. Having sanctioned by the U.S, the star of their airforce, the F-16s were severally hit by lack of spares and most of the time grounded. The other 2 sources to procure modern Aircraft- Russia, have been sealed off due to the legacy of Soviet era friendship, current market in India & India’s pressure- and the other source, the European Union, for their extremely high costs. The third source, the Chinese, at that time were still flying their reverse engineered MiG-21s. In those circumstances, “Never again” was the motto of PAF and it instantly jumped into the project of further reversing the reverse engineered MiG-21, known as Super-7(a.k.a Super F-7) to obtain self reliance. The result of that project is the JF-17. So the decision was appropriate at that time, in those situations. However now with China having developed the J-10, and going by the recent reports of offering ToT(Transfer of Technology) to Pakistan, one wonders why are the Pakistanis still ordering 250 planes. Is the trauma of F-16 sanctions so high that they don’t even trust the Chinese? This can't be the case because they still need the Chinese to procure the RD-93 engines for them, even after the Chinese transfer all their associated JF-17 tech to PAC. So why...? The answer lies with their ego/psyche rather than the trauma. Unlike J-10, Pakistan shares copyright to JF-17 and that, for some weird reason, gives them something to celebrate about. This is strange for the reason, war machines are for fighting wars and achieving tactical & strategic objectives, not for gloating about who holds the copyrights. When JF-17 comes face to face with MKI or UPG, there won’t be much to celebrate about it, or the few millions if at all it earns through exports. In the end, it’s all about defending ones homeland from the enemy, and not copyrights.

JF-17 would have been the best fighter and a sensible decision in the absence of J-10, but now its reason for existence is as obsolete as the fighter itself.
Gosh you wrote this shit?
I read about 2 sentences and I knew not to waste my time ...Indian tamasha continues...
 

SQ8

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Imagine being so dumb and retarded that you copy paste an 11 year old gibberish to satisfy your tiny little ego,
View attachment 767557
source of this cow shit : **** JF-17 Arrives In Farnborough - Livefist (livefistdefence.com)
@SQ8 @The Eagle can you please do the needful?
One has to imagine how low the bar has to be for gratifying oneself that they spend their major life efforts to go and post nonsense like this all over the place. I mean do these people not have other hobbies or traveling or exploring that they consider this their highest achievement.

Ill keep saying it and including myself at one point who would go on about “aman ki asha” thinking our problem was confined to the Indian state. No, a large percentage of Indians hate Pakistanis.. not Pakistan. They hold such vile hatred for you that they are willing to sacrifice their humanity to cause suffering for you. Understand that and look at them with that lens next time you think its ok to watch an Indian movie or listen to any new music from them, or go to an Indian restaurant outside of Pakistan.

We would want nothing better than peace with dignity for all, but these people have no interest in anything other than misery and death for Pakistanis.
 

PakFactor

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One has to imagine how low the bar has to be for gratifying oneself that they spend their major life efforts to go and post nonsense like this all over the place. I mean do these people not have other hobbies or traveling or exploring that they consider this their highest achievement.

Ill keep saying it and including myself at one point who would go on about “aman ki asha” thinking our problem was confined to the Indian state. No, a large percentage of Indians hate Pakistanis.. not Pakistan. They hold such vile hatred for you that they are willing to sacrifice their humanity to cause suffering for you. Understand that and look at them with that lens next time you think its ok to watch an Indian movie or listen to any new music from them, or go to an Indian restaurant outside of Pakistan.

We would want nothing better than peace with dignity for all, but these people have no interest in anything other than misery and death for Pakistanis.
I can't believe someone would write such utter crap, let alone waste such time.
 

Windjammer

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The JF-17 is causing even more pain to these Indians ever since it visited them in IOK.
When the test came, the JF-17 proved more capable than anything in Indian inventory.
 

The Maverick

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The JF-17 is causing even more pain to these Indians ever since it visited them in IOK.
When the test came, the JF-17 proved more capable than anything in Indian inventory.

I'm.confused
the Indians showed a,wreckage of a,amraam bvr
the Indians clearly stated 6 to 8 f16 crosses loc
there is no mention of jf17 any where
finally where was the jf17 the night before on 26th February when 12 mirage 2000 crossed into balakot without pakistan even detecting the raid
 

Windjammer

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I'm.confused
the Indians showed a,wreckage of a,amraam bvr
the Indians clearly stated 6 to 8 f16 crosses loc
there is no mention of jf17 any where
finally where was the jf17 the night before on 26th February when 12 mirage 2000 crossed into balakot without pakistan even detecting the raid
Confused you are indeed.
F-16s were deployed for interception and fighter sweep.
Who do you think carried out the strikes on Indian military compounds......Mirages and JF-17s.
And you still think your Mirages crossed into Balakot.....that night, the IAF aircraft tried to ingress from some half a dozen sides and all were thwarted by PAF, the Mirages barely managed to cross the border and launched their weapons in a hurry thus missing their intended target completely.
Now let me ask you this, after provocation of trying to sneak in during middle of night, the IAF would or should have been on full alert for the PAF response and PAF did respond by not sneaking in in dark but in daring daylight operation.....where was IAF which is no doubt one of the largest air forces in the world.

1628190217620.png
 

maverick1977

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One has to imagine how low the bar has to be for gratifying oneself that they spend their major life efforts to go and post nonsense like this all over the place. I mean do these people not have other hobbies or traveling or exploring that they consider this their highest achievement.

Ill keep saying it and including myself at one point who would go on about “aman ki asha” thinking our problem was confined to the Indian state. No, a large percentage of Indians hate Pakistanis.. not Pakistan. They hold such vile hatred for you that they are willing to sacrifice their humanity to cause suffering for you. Understand that and look at them with that lens next time you think its ok to watch an Indian movie or listen to any new music from them, or go to an Indian restaurant outside of Pakistan.

We would want nothing better than peace with dignity for all, but these people have no interest in anything other than misery and death for Pakistanis.

There are a lot of Pakistanis who are now inclined to believe that raising Flag on red fort might be the only solution to the area, otherwise there will never be any peace.
 

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