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Floods in Pakistan: Biggest Global Polluters US, Europe, China and India Must Accept Responsibility

SoulSpokesman

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@Cheepek

Not to forget India has ~25% of it's land under forests compared to just ~5% in Pakistan.

That is an apple and oranges comparison. Most of Pakistan is arid land, arid mountains and plateaus of Balochistan and deserts of lower Punjab and Sindh, beyond the river flood plains. These lands have been devoid of forests since the dawn of History. Large chunks of India had forests as natural vegetation.

Regards
 

INS_Vikrant

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Not to forget India has ~25% of it's land under forests compared to just ~5% in Pakistan.

Bhai India is much closer to equator with Central and Southern India lying inside tropical zone, naturally we'd have more forest cover being a tropical country.
330px-World_map_indicating_tropics_and_subtropics.png
 

Cheepek

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@Cheepek

Not to forget India has ~25% of it's land under forests compared to just ~5% in Pakistan.

That is an apple and oranges comparison. Most of Pakistan is arid land, arid mountains and plateaus of Balochistan and deserts of lower Punjab and Sindh, beyond the river flood plains. These lands have been devoid of forests since the dawn of History. Large chunks of India had forests as natural vegetation.

Regards
How is it apples to oranges comparison when we are talking of CO2 emissions? Don't tress absorb CO2?
 

Wood

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Brofessor sb,

Please go through the data carefully. India's contribution to global CO2 pollution is only 10 times or so Pak's while it has 6-7 times its population. In per capita terms it is hardly that much worse than Pakistan as an emitter. India's total emissions per capita is a fraction of the world's.

Besides, India too is a victim of climate change. Almost every other year, large parts of India especially North, East and NE get flooded plus there are cyclones every year. Just because it is a much larger nation, it doesnt get adequate coverage because other parts of the country can make up for the damage.

In short, India should receive and not make reparations. Besides, how do you think India which is very poor itself- famously it has more hungry and poor people than Lanka or Pak, ever meet those reparation demands. Those demands should be made only of rich countries including your taller than mountain friend.

Regards

@Joe Shearer @VCheng @Wood @Jango
Developed countries will help Pakistan. Developing countries will not be a position to help anyone but for themselves. However, the timing of this flood that coincides with a global recession is a double whammy for Pakistan. It will affect how much the developed nations can spare for humanitarian support. But some debt write off or deferral for Pakistan is possible though.
 

Sliver

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looks like trying to find any and all ways to get money from others. Pakistan deep state has reduced Pakistani citizens to justifying anything to get $$ from others.
with 220 million people and so many resources along with a critical geographic location. Pakistan should have been in a much better position.
 

WotOne

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Reality Check #1.

The main culprits for the flood devastation are
1. selfish, ethnicity based politics which has prevented dam construction to manage the rivers.
2. 100% corrupt system where construction contracts are awarded to dodgy companies that pocket huge profits and do substandard work putting people's lives at risk.

Reality Check #2.

Most of the aid money for reconstruction will go to these same corrupt companies who will again make huge profits and again do substandard work which will collapse and kill people in the next natural disaster (flood, earthquake, whatever).
 

RiazHaq

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Pakistan’s #flood crisis could be an opportunity for real change. Devastating floods have also hit #Florida. Considering the global nature of #climate challenge, at some point #US & #Pakistan must find the courage to work together on "Green Marshall Plan" https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/09/29/pakistan-flood-crisis-climate-change-warning/

This week, Americans are understandably focused on the hurricane-related flooding in Florida, which is causing tragedy for thousands. Yet there is little attention in the United States to the fact that Pakistan has been flooded since mid-June, a catastrophe that is still causing unspeakable suffering for tens of millions.


Both of these crises owe much to the same phenomenon — climate change. But aside from some limited aid, there’s scant U.S.-Pakistan cooperation on long-term solutions. That has to change, according to Pakistani Foreign Minister Bilawal Bhutto Zardari, who was in the United States this week pitching his proposal for a “Green Marshall Plan.” In meetings with Secretary of State Antony Blinken, U.N. Secretary General António Guterres and others, Zardari argued for a way those countries most responsible for climate change can help those countries most affected — and, in turn, help themselves.

It’s a big idea, and there are reasons for skepticism. But considering the global nature of the climate challenge, at some point the United States and Pakistan must find the courage to work together. In the process, the two countries might find a way back to being true allies, which would benefit both sides and balance China’s rising influence in the South Asia region.

“We have to find the opportunity in this crisis,” Zardari told me. “There are two ways of us going forward. We can do this dirtier, badly, in a way that will be worse for us and worse for the environment, or we can try to build back better in a greener, more climate-resilient manner.”

Zardari’s call for a “Green Marshall Plan” is meant to evoke America’s historical penchant for pursuing its enlightened self-interest. The idea also plays into President Biden’s own Build Back Better World concept. The theory is that Western government support for private-sector investment in climate-resilient, ecologically sustainable infrastructure in Pakistan would redound to the benefit of Western industry and help mitigate the future climate-related crises that are sure to come.

Florida will have several days of rain. In Pakistan, it rained for more than three months, submerging one-third of the country in a body of water than can be seen from space. The high floodwaters have created a cascade of problems, devastating Pakistan’s agriculture, manufacturing, trade and public health sectors.

Floods are almost a perennial occurrence in Pakistan, but this year’s continuing disaster is uniquely cataclysmic, impacting more than 33 million people (more than Florida’s entire population), including 16 million children and more than 600,000 pregnant women, according to the United Nations.

The flood and its aftereffects also risk throwing Pakistan right back into the economic crisis it was clawing its way out of. Pakistan was already on the hook to pay back $1 billion of the $10 billion it owes the Paris Club by the end of this year. Islamabad also owes some $30 billion to China. Now the country is being forced to borrow billions more to deal with the current situation.

The real question, Zardari said, is not whether the international community will come through with short-term aid and debt relief. The challenge is for the world to realize that Pakistan’s flood crisis won’t be the last or the worst, meaning the international response must take a far broader view.

In a world where covid-19, the Russia-Ukraine war and the worldwide economic slowdown are commanding the attention of policymakers in Western capitals, the bandwidth for new and expensive ideas is narrow. Zardari knows it’s a tough sell.
 

etylo

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Since the the west and japan consume the majority of the industrial products produced in china over the decades, the west and japan should be mainly resposible for the carbon produced cumulatively in china over the years.

See the complete cumulative emissions of carbon per captia by major countries over the centuries in the following link:

 
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lastofthepatriots

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So just because other nations are more developed they need to compensate you for being poor and incompetent? Pollution in other countries is because they are more developed, have more power plants, cars, acs etc etc. If you were more developed you would be doing the same thing. Similarly, Pakistan's emissions are probably 100 times that of several African countries, will you compensate them for climate change next time there is a flood or cyclone in Africa?

It is not as simple as just looking at total emissions and assigning blame. Lets look at China or Japan for example, they have high emissions because they are the the factories of the world. If you weren't buying those products, Chinese factories wouldnt be making them, and thus wouldnt be throwing these emissions. So even though emissions came for China, it is ultimately everyone's fault, no one is stopping other countries from making these products on their own and adding to theirown total emission.

Bochri ke mattarchor, rail line par haag ne walay developed countries ki baat kar re ho?

Gandua teri janta jab gaand hila ri thi oxygen tanks ke liye tab developed country kidar thi?

Mattarchor, hawaa ke liye bheeg mang re te tum logh.

Tum logon se kisne paisay maangay he? Bhart mein haar saal humaray flood victims se zyada bharti bhook se maar re he aur khud tu developed nation gaand mein ghussa ke le kar behta he.

Check karo in bosarchodo ko... mataa ka muttar pi pi ke dimagh kharab hua he inka.
 
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Meengla

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The solution is more damns and better water management, which successive governments have failed.

Yes, that's the solution. It is better to be flooded then have too little water, IF one has to make a choice. There are theories out there that the Indus Valley Civilization died because of water issues.
 

Baba_Yaga

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Bochri ke mattarchor, rail line par haag ne walay developed countries ki baat kar re ho?

Gandua teri janta jab gaand hila ri thi oxygen tanks ke liye tab developed country kidar thi?

Mattarchor, hawaa ke liye bheeg mang re te tum logh.

Tum logon se kisne paisay maangay he? Bhart mein haar saal humaray flood victims se zyada bharti bhook se maar re he aur khud tu developed nation gaand mein ghussa ke le kar behta he.

Check karo in bosarchodo ko... mataa ka muttar pi pi ke dimagh kharab hua he inka.
U mad bruh?i clearly hit a nerve :rofl:
 

VkdIndian

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Gobar residue will linger in the air for too long.
Unlikely. Gobar after combustion reacts like most solid fuels.

You all are planning to nuke India? What about your friend China?
Hamari gas polluted aur China ki gas Khushboo? Kyun ?
 

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