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F-7P and F-7PG

GriffinsRule

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This high viz scheme is only used on squadrons that teach air combat maneuvering or play DACT type roles. Its so rookie pilots have an easier time tracking and acquiring the aircraft.

There are many reason for it. Here is a Saudi F-15SA in a similar scheme. This scheme has been used in F-15s since inception (F-15A era) for newly developed variants.
1614672150091.png


US Navy similarly uses high-viz scheme for its training aircraft.
1614672368388.png


US Coast Guard basically has all its aircraft in high viz for obvious reasons. JASDF has historically used very high viz scheme on its jets and trainers as well.
 
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ziaulislam

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I do not think we have F-7s in any frontline units, just for training.

The PG is indeed serving with three frontline units, these airframes are relatively new and of course with better bubble canopy, cranked wing design, Grifo radar and AIM-9L a very decent point defence fighter.

I think PAF would like to maintain the PGs for some time, advantages are

1) For peacetime air policing on quiet Iran and Afghan borders (where we have actually stationed the PGs), these re cheap and effective (unautherised flights, airliners not responding, keeping an eye on Iranian/Afghan jets coming to close etc)
2) As someone mentioned earlier, cheap way of getting hours up, especially for officers in desk jobs (as most of PAF would have experianced F-7 at LIFT training most of PAF can fly it to keep up hours)
3) If our frontline force entirely becomes JF-17/F-16/AZM, then always handy to have a small cheap jet for DACT against.

The disadvantges of the PG include

1) Range, I think an hour up in the air is the best you get. These birds do not have any plumbing for air to air refuelling either
2) Light combat load, pretty much maxed out with 4 AIM-9Ls and 3 fuel tanks
3) The Grifo is a decent set but in world of AESA will easily be jammed in the future if fighting a high end enemy
4) Lack of data link. Unlike JF-17s/F-16s the avionics and cockpit cannot support giving a secure air picture from say a Erieye

For the above, as mentioned, decent, cheap fighter for quiet border areas
But they were rated for only 2000 hours
They are almost at 4000 hrs

So my guess they will go out very soon as soon as we get any replacement

Mirages due to their niche role will stay
 

Gomig-21

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Don't understand why the Egyptians use hi vis colour scheme on their aircraft, it's like painting a massive bright bullseye sign saying "come hit me".
Think about it for a minute. The same exact thing works for the Egyptian pilots as well. If you're depending on the visual aspect (which was not the case with the orange swaths marked on the wings and tail etc.) but people seem to think that was the reason and that it would only benefit the enemy, well that's hardly the truth and a very narrow minded view of it since like I said, it works both ways because if the enemy sees the orange and its an invitation, well for the EAF pilot it's just as easy to see an aircraft without the orange swaths and it's screaming "come and hit me!" See, works both ways but most people are way too narrow minded to see that and automatically think the disadvantage is to the EAF.

Either way, that had nothing to do with WVR dogfighting anyway. But just to correct your misassumption.
 

SQ8

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Think about it for a minute. The same exact thing works for the Egyptian pilots as well. If you're depending on the visual aspect (which was not the case with the orange swaths marked on the wings and tail etc.) but people seem to think that was the reason and that it would only benefit the enemy, well that's hardly the truth and a very narrow minded view of it since like I said, it works both ways because if the enemy sees the orange and its an invitation, well for the EAF pilot it's just as easy to see an aircraft without the orange swaths and it's screaming "come and hit me!" See, works both ways but most people are way too narrow minded to see that and automatically think the disadvantage is to the EAF.

Either way, that had nothing to do with WVR dogfighting anyway. But just to correct your misassumption.
Nothing to do with hit me as such but more like dont hit me!
Both IDF & EAF operated common platforms such as the F-16 and Mirage. You wont see this in the Mig-35’s or the Rafales.
 

CriticalThought

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The F7-PGs are a very good platform for point defence. I don't know if a dedicated PD fighter fits into PAFs overall philosophy, but I full support a continuation of F7-PG service. Classically, the most frustrating thing about the F7s was maintenance. This experience might have been a reason why the JF-17s were specifically made for ease of maintenance. Now, it might be a good exercise for PAC to cut in a few removable panels in the front to make maintenance easier.

Overall, the F7-PG is like putting a human on top of a supersonic cruise missile. Heck, it's actually shaped like a cruise missile. Imagine them scattered along major highways during war time, and popping out suddenly to harass enemy fighters. A lot can be done with this little gem.
 

Khan vilatey

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Hey I have heard that the cranked double delta of the f-7pg allows amazing low speed handling . This further reduces the risk for new pilots. Can someone please confirm this vis a vis f-7p and mig-22 bis.

k
 

khanasifm

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Hey I have heard that the cranked double delta of the f-7pg allows amazing low speed handling . This further reduces the risk for new pilots. Can someone please confirm this vis a vis f-7p and mig-22 bis.

k
Per ac tufail eval landing speed and take speed reduced by xx% compare to f-7p I think it was 18-20%
 

Bigbang1983

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This high viz scheme is only used on squadrons that teach air combat maneuvering or play DACT type roles. Its so rookie pilots have an easier time tracking and acquiring the aircraft.

There are many reason for it. Here is a Saudi F-15SA in a similar scheme. This scheme has been used in F-15s since inception (F-15A era) for newly developed variants.
View attachment 721381

US Navy similarly uses high-viz scheme for its training aircraft.
View attachment 721382

US Coast Guard basically has all its aircraft in high viz for obvious reasons. JASDF has historically used very high viz scheme on its jets and trainers as well.
Salam,

I don't think the F-15 in the picture belongs to Saudi Airforce. You can clearly see the star and strips just below the cockpit.
To me this looks like a test plane or a technology demonstrator. Maybe the loadout can give us some hints.
Seniors might be able to help.
 

GriffinsRule

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Salam,

I don't think the F-15 in the picture belongs to Saudi Airforce. You can clearly see the star and strips just below the cockpit.
To me this looks like a test plane or a technology demonstrator. Maybe the loadout can give us some hints.
Seniors might be able to help.
Maybe you are right but I think it's common to have US temporary markings on test planes.

Link could be wrong too.
 

The Raven

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This high viz scheme is only used on squadrons that teach air combat maneuvering or play DACT type roles. Its so rookie pilots have an easier time tracking and acquiring the aircraft.

There are many reason for it. Here is a Saudi F-15SA in a similar scheme. This scheme has been used in F-15s since inception (F-15A era) for newly developed variants.
View attachment 721381

US Navy similarly uses high-viz scheme for its training aircraft.
View attachment 721382

US Coast Guard basically has all its aircraft in high viz for obvious reasons. JASDF has historically used very high viz scheme on its jets and trainers as well.
Sure, but these hi-vis schemes are not used by other airforces in frontline combat, the Egyptians do.
 

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