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ziaulislam

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F35 with its stealth and 6 AIM120Ds are going to come near and slaughter any fourth fighter be it rafale, typhoon or the f15

there is simply no competition..

evn in strike role it can carry 2x500pound lb and multiple smart ammunition without being seen
 

Figaro

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F35 with its stealth and 6 AIM120Ds are going to come near and slaughter any fourth fighter be it rafale, typhoon or the f15

there is simply no competition..

evn in strike role it can carry 2x500pound lb and multiple smart ammunition without being seen
Any fifth generation fighter, even the Su-57, should be able to defeat any fourth generation fighter period. There is simply a huge generational difference. Unless the fifth generation fighter is dumb enough to move into WVR, then victory is basically assured for every engagement.
 

dbc

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On US specifications !
The one on Rafale, (made by the same company if I remember well) is perfectly functioning.
Another exemple of the lack of technical culture by the US....

Take your medicine my brain limited friend, and go to bed.
No my ignorant friend a Rafale crashed into the Indian ocean near Pakistan due to a technical fault by the same French company. Don't be depressed the French still make decent wine.
 

Figaro

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No my ignorant friend a Rafale crashed into the Indian ocean near Pakistan due to a technical fault by the same French company. Don't be depressed the French still make decent wine.
The Rafale is still one of the best 4th generation fighter aircraft available ... there is no doubt about it. But to say it can stand toe to toe or even compete with the F-35 is just ridiculous.
 

LeGenD

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Any fifth generation fighter, even the Su-57, should be able to defeat any fourth generation fighter period. There is simply a huge generational difference. Unless the fifth generation fighter is dumb enough to move into WVR, then victory is basically assured for every engagement.
Su-57 is not a true 5th generation aircraft - assuming American standards.



Su-57 is still in development phase (expected to receive a new pair of engines among other parts), and will most likely attain maturity as a platform in the late 2020s. Even then it would be in the league of latest F-15 variants at most - very impressive for Russia given its resources and limitations.
 

BON PLAN

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"Sources familiar with the negotiations said a working idea was for Israeli air defenses to be able to detect the UAE F-35s with technology that effectively defeats the stealth capabilities of the jets"
=> No? incredible news... so that marvellous flying goose can be seen thanks to new technology.... not so new ! they are called multistatism and low band radars.

"Washington already demands that any F-35 sold to foreign governments cannot match the performance of U.S. jets, said both a congressional staffer and a source familiar with past sales"
=> there are the full spec (but low perf) F35 for US army, and the low spec and low perf for the others. Nice !
 
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BON PLAN

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No my ignorant friend a Rafale crashed into the Indian ocean near Pakistan due to a technical fault by the same French company. Don't be depressed the French still make decent wine.
That Rafale went out of full due to a pilot error.

A F35 crashed in the pacific ocean near Japan but no one knows why... And you can be depressed : your wine is awfull.
 

Figaro

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That Rafale went out of full due to a pilot error.

A F35 crashed in the pacific ocean near Japan but no one knows why... And you can be depressed : your wine is awfull.
Please don't tell me you actually believe a Rafale stands a chance against the F-35 in a one on one scenario without any AWAC backup or datalinks ... :crazy:. The Rafales could potentially be useful in an integrated air environment alongside other fifth generation aircraft (as vanguard) but as stand alone aircraft, I am afraid unless the Rafale gets within WVR, it will not have any hope.
nope it was ruled a design flaw :lol: made worse by general incompetence

https://omnirole-rafale.com/accidents-et-retraits/

stick to wine making.
Every aircraft has flaws. The F-35 IMHO has several design flaws as well ... especially compared to that of the F-22. But it also offers numerous improvements over the F-22 and it can definietely handle any 4th generation fighter out there with ease. The only realistic way the Rafale can beat the F-35 is via classic dogfight.
 

BON PLAN

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Please don't tell me you actually believe a Rafale stands a chance against the F-35 in a one on one scenario without any AWAC backup or datalinks ... :crazy:. The Rafales could potentially be useful in an integrated air environment alongside other fifth generation aircraft (as vanguard) but as stand alone aircraft, I am afraid unless the Rafale gets within WVR, it will not have any hope.
The F35 stealth quality are unknown. It's mainly marketing...
A flight of Rafale hit a turkish base in Lybian desert without being detected....

The F35 is over budget, short on promised performances (can't so far used it's laser tagreting systme to illuminate a fixed target, not to speak a moving one, no super cruise, less agile than F16...), not FOC. It remains a wet dream.

So a dream against a real fighter....
 

BON PLAN

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F-35s Lure Buyers as a Question Looms: How Will It Do in Combat?


"The intensive combat simulation testing of the fighter jet, which was supposed to occur in 2017 and most recently was set for this December, is almost certain to slip into next year because of difficulties finishing technical preparations, according to the Pentagon’s weapons buyer and testing office. "

late, always late....
 

dbc

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F-35s Lure Buyers as a Question Looms: How Will It Do in Combat?


"The intensive combat simulation testing of the fighter jet, which was supposed to occur in 2017 and most recently was set for this December, is almost certain to slip into next year because of difficulties finishing technical preparations, according to the Pentagon’s weapons buyer and testing office. "

late, always late....
I admire your crusade against the F-35, tilting at windmills like the fabled Don Quixote of La Mancha,
You can huff, you can puff but the Rafale is no match for the F-35 on the only metric that matters to Dassault and Lockheed - market share.

The Rafale is already obsolete give it up take up Pétanque like my father he plays everyday with his friends in Montpellier.
 

UKBengali

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Any fifth generation fighter, even the Su-57, should be able to defeat any fourth generation fighter period. There is simply a huge generational difference. Unless the fifth generation fighter is dumb enough to move into WVR, then victory is basically assured for every engagement.
SU-57 is not a VLO aircraft according to the Indians who have dropped out.

I doubt it would beat an AESA equipped Eurofighter or Rafale with Meteor.
 

UKBengali

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The problem is I doubt the UK has the money nor the will for the Tempest, esp given the cash crunch the gov is in right now. The US would also undoubtedly refuse to transfer core stealth/5th gen technology to even its closest ally, something like the Tempest just isn't feasible at all. The cut down by 50% just shows the UK is pretty cash strapped at this point ... which makes the Tempest development even less likely.
1. UK has stealth experience from working on Taranis UCAV and being the only Tier-1 partner on the F-35 where it was responsible for design and manufacture of some airframe components. UK's BAE systems designs and manufactures machines to create airframe components for the F-35 airframe.
If China can make a stealth fighter like J-20, surely UK can also with a better base to start from.

2. As for funding Italy is already in and Sweden has shown interest and may join the programme. UK has committed 3 billion US dollars for development by 2025 and the programme is in full swing now.

It was always on the cards that the UK would reduce the huge number of 138 F-35s on order. 70 F-35Bs is a good number to fly off the 2 aircraft carriers.
Even a F-35A could never deliver anywhere near the performance that a UK built next-gen fighter can provide with two monster adaptive cycle engines from RR and so buying so many would be a waste of money.
 
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