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Export bids for JF-17 Thunder Multirole Lightweight Fighter Aircraft

araz

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What does jf offers that Arabs don't have already. Most of what they buy is more based on politics and economic favors and Pakistan can't offer any of these. Jf17 is a potent aircraft intended to be a stop gap with a potential to grow but it's not in league of big boy toys that Arabs have.
This is possibly the 4th or 5th visit of the Qataris. They have been involved and eagerly looking at the block 3 developing. Even as a LIFT or a low level run around it has its utility as well as pilot experience. With restrictions from EU and US they can get PAF to still train their pilots. I dont think we should get too excited just yet but something is definitely going on.
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Meliodas

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I dont think Russia can produce AESA. Until now they can offer PESA only. A big reason why Algeria cancel Su-35 deal.
Afik Russia has and can produce AESA radars, as it has them on ships and s400 system. On the aerial side they do have AESAs but there operational deployment at squadron level is yet to be seen. They did showcase Zhuk (AESA) versions at different exhibitions like MAKS 2019, aeroindia 2015, zhunhai 2016. It seems that Russia is struggling to create confidence in this for it's own and customer air force due to lack of investment and pace in this line of technology.

On the JF-17 side, I am still skeptical if the AESA platform is completely mature rather it's integration will help in it's evolution. Just a little tod bid if aesa is what Arabs are looking for they should go look out for Japan as it was the one that pioneered it.
 
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The Eagle

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Afik Russia has and can produce AESA radars, as it has them on ships and s400 system. On the aerial side they do have AESAs but there operational deployment at squadron level is yet to be seen. They did showcase Zhuk (AESA) versions at different exhibitions like MAKS 2019, aeroindia 2015, zhunhai 2016. It seems that Russia is struggling to create confidence in this for it's own and customer air force due to lack of investment and pace in this line of technology.

On the JF-17 side, I am still skeptical if the AESA platform is completely mature rather it's integration will help in it's evolution. Just a little tod bid if aesa is what Arabs are looking for they should go look out for Japan as it was the one that pioneered it.

Name it correctly. It's JF-17, please.
 

Trailer23

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I dont think Russia can produce AESA. Until now they can offer PESA only. A big reason why Algeria cancel Su-35 deal.
The MiG-35 comes with both the PESA and AESA Radar from the Zhuk Family.

It is the first (Russian Jet) to be equipped with an AESA radar.
 

Beast

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The MiG-35 comes with both the PESA and AESA Radar from the Zhuk Family.

It is the first (Russian Jet) to be equipped with an AESA radar.
Why didn't the Su-35 equipped with AESA? and seems like no buyer for Mig-35 too.

Seems like nobody trust Russian AESA.

Afik Russia has and can produce AESA radars, as it has them on ships and s400 system. On the aerial side they do have AESAs but there operational deployment at squadron level is yet to be seen. They did showcase Zhuk (AESA) versions at different exhibitions like MAKS 2019, aeroindia 2015, zhunhai 2016. It seems that Russia is struggling to create confidence in this for it's own and customer air force due to lack of investment and pace in this line of technology.

On the JF-17 side, I am still skeptical if the AESA platform is completely mature rather it's integration will help in it's evolution. Just a little tod bid if aesa is what Arabs are looking for they should go look out for Japan as it was the one that pioneered it.
There is no need to sceptical about Chinese AESA. Russian has talk about fighter jet AESA for long like Mig-35 and yet to have any potential buyer going for AESA.

While it's strange why Russian Su-35 is using PESA despite your claim Russian possess AESA tech for fighter jet.

There is no doubt China semi industries are far superior than Russia. We produced design and produced our own chips for our military industries and even in civilian level, Chinese presence is felt while no where Russia to be seen.

As for Japan AESA, from a simple google. The AESA for their F-2 is nothing but failure. Japan maybe pioneer but they are definitely not leader in AESA and behind China. There is reason why China is the only Asian countries able to land a rover on Mars and not Japan.
 
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Irfan Baloch

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This is possibly the 4th or 5th visit of the Qataris. They have been involved and eagerly looking at the block 3 developing. Even as a LIFT or a low level run around it has its utility as well as pilot experience. With restrictions from EU and US they can get PAF to still train their pilots. I dont think we should get too excited just yet but something is definitely going on.
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my wild guess is that any Arab interest in JF17 is from Iranian perspective.
in case china sells the FC1 to Iranians then Arabs and their Israeli allies will need to know this jet and train from aggressor perspective.
Although they can do it without purchasing since Pakistan will be happy to station few JF17s along with pilots ( for fraction of few Dollars) in Qatar to train them on how to fight Chinese jet with their Western jets.
 

tphuang

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The MiG-35 comes with both the PESA and AESA Radar from the Zhuk Family.

It is the first (Russian Jet) to be equipped with an AESA radar.
You might want to read about the reality of Mig-35 and AESA radar

There is a huge difference between promoting things for export and actually having it in production and on aircraft. Russians are very good at showing prototypes on air shows, but not very good at delivering it into production. For AESA radar, they simply haven't been able to get the cost of producing T/R modules down due to their backward electronics industry.

What China has is a relatively modern electronics industry along with a lot of investment in military radar. That started with AESA radar on KJ-2000 and Type 052C over 15 years ago. With continued investment and improving domestic industry, they have been able to put AESA radar on all their recent aircraft since 2015. That's really only behind America and France. EFT still does not have AESA radar. Just think about that. JF-17 will get AESA radars before EFT.

Again, look at what's in production rather than what's promoted in air shows. Huge difference. Don't fall for capabilities that sales teams are promising to be ready in a couple of years.
 

araz

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my wild guess is that any Arab interest in JF17 is from Iranian perspective.
in case china sells the FC1 to Iranians then Arabs and their Israeli allies will need to know this jet and train from aggressor perspective.
Although they can do it without purchasing since Pakistan will be happy to station few JF17s along with pilots ( for fraction of few Dollars) in Qatar to train them on how to fight Chinese jet with their Western jets.
You could be right but I would tend to think they want PAF walas to train their boys and PAF walas have stipulated that they buy the B variant so training regimes "similar to PAF" can be setup in house. The Qataris on their part also want to establish local industry and a small plane from an easy source remains a good bet. The West is now an unreliable entity for all and sundry. And when you start seeing red the Habibis turn to Pakistan for help.
I could be totally wrong but I could bet you a cup of tea the truth lies somewhere in what I have written. They can get Western platforms but will not get TOT from anywhere and independence from Western clutches is becoming a matter of survival of these regimes. The russian door is closed for the moment so where else can they go to?
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tphuang

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Totally unrelated and apologies for being off topic but do you know why the PAF KEs couuuld not get upgraded to AESA radars as PAF had sent one over to China and it stayed there for 18 months or so, Help appreciated. You can respond in the relevant topic and ttag me if you want.
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Sorry I have no idea what KEs are. I have not been following things closely for a few years now.

As for the Qatari deal, I think you should offer everything available whether its building local industry, full ToT or whatever else to secure it. There is no greater boost possible for a program like JF-17 than having Air Force with advanced 4++ generation aircraft like Rafale, F15E and EFT willing to get involved with it.

For China at least, getting into Qatari market could open door for naval export or J-35 export down the line. And this would apply to other Arab countries that may also want to boost their local industry.
 

The SC

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Argentinian-Ambassador-holds-a-model-of-an-FAA-JF-17D-Block-III-during-his-visit-to-CATIC-this-week-864x1024.jpg


Argentina's ambassador to China visited the JF-17 Block III manufacturing facility this week and carried a model FAA JF-17D Block III aircraft, where he met with CATIC officials this month to formulate a "comprehensive defense strategy between the Argentine government and China."

CATIC, a Chinese state-owned company that focuses on exports, is managing negotiations for government loans to the Argentine government to purchase the 12 fighters that will be manufactured at the Pakistan Aviation Complex.

Argentine President Alberto Fernandez is scheduled to arrive in Beijing on February 4 for an official visit to celebrate the 50th anniversary of the establishment of diplomatic relations between the two countries and to attend the opening of the Winter Olympics.

Ambassador Vaca Narvaga previously met Jiao Kaihe, President of China North Industries Group Corporation Limited (NORINCO), Argentina is likely to contract 88 armored vehicles as well as set up a vehicle manufacturing unit in Argentina to share technologies. He believes that negotiations are still ongoing.


https://eurasiantimes.com/jf-17-thunder-argentine-ambassador-visits-chinese-aerospace-firm/
 

siegecrossbow

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Looks like a proper order about to come

Like I’ve always said it is more than just a simple warplane deal. It is about Argentina providing for China’s mineral and agricultural needs in exchange for tech and defense. Unless Russia could stomach 300k metric tons of beef a year I don’t see the Mikoyan offer as very competitive.
 

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