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Exclusive: Shahpar 2 missile Firing video

Aesterix

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We are already displaying it in different countries for selling purpose, so yes video does mean alot and it can have huge impacts on drone buyer countries
Please don't compare it with Shampoo ads and get back to the topic.
 

Bilal9

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Can someone explain to an AGM missile noob, how this BURRAQ compares to - say, a hellfire?

Can these be launched from, say an MI-171?

BTW Shahpar looks similar to a Bayraktar...
Please don't compare it with Shampoo ads and get back to the topic.
Videos are just one of the first steps in a purchase decision. Seeing in person is believing.

BTW congrats to Pakistani bhais, for achieving implementation of what seems to be a very capable and effective UCAV platform. :-)
 
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Bilal Khan (Quwa)

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good luck to a country, which buys military systems based on videos. It takes ages to close a large weapons deal. How do you think this time is spent? Watching videos?
In large B2G procurement, vendors use professional videos to get the attention of potential decision-makers. They use it to get in front of as many key people and give those people a positive perception of the company and product. It's just one piece of the whole process, but an important piece.

Anyways, our point here isn't just that the videos suck, but because we know why they suck. The marketing work was given to people who don't understand marketing. This is such a critical gap in who we are as Pakistanis that we can't even sell our own basmati rice without Indians appropriating the name.
 

JawadKKhan

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This is how companies advertise there products
Bro, level of our marketing / advertising is evident from the wrong specs ( 7 feet length) of JF-17 at Dubai air show. Yet no body cared at PAC. Its evident from PAC poorly designed website with typos / specs mistakes (using pounds instead of KG for payload etc.) They are extremely poor in UI / creativity / Digital marketing. IF they do not have professionals for such services, they can just outsource this to any pakistani IT agency.
 

Bossman

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In large B2G procurement, vendors use professional videos to get the attention of potential decision-makers. They use it to get in front of as many key people and give those people a positive perception of the company and product. It's just one piece of the whole process, but an important piece.

Anyways, our point here isn't just that the videos suck, but because we know why they suck. The marketing work was given to people who don't understand marketing. This is such a critical gap in who we are as Pakistanis that we can't even sell our own basmati rice without Indians appropriating the name.
Weapon systems are not B2B. You never answered my earlier questions related to Iraq. If you knew the answers, you will not be equating consumer or even white goods marketing with the arms trade. I am not saying you guys are wrong but please educate yourself before making sweeping statements and criticizing everything for the sake of criticizing.
 

Bilal Khan (Quwa)

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Weapon systems are not B2B. You never answered my earlier questions related to Iraq. If you knew the answers, you will not be equating consumer or even white goods marketing with the arms trade. I am not saying you guys are wrong but please educate yourself before making sweeping statements and criticizing everything for the sake of criticizing.
First, I said B2G -- Business-to-Government.

Second, it's not 'criticism for the sake of criticizing'. We are dealing with inaccurate JF-17 specs by PAC; weird features like "provision for optional pilot" in the Shahpar-2 sheet; and other weird stuff that shows us a lack of quality controls in our marketing work. Some decision-makers are going to see those sheets and conclude, "yeah these guys aren't serious." If that's the view they have, then that's it, our product isn't going to get evaluated.

Third, the point I made was not about the evaluation process, but actually getting invited into that discussion in the first place. How do you think that happens? It happens when you get on the minds of the decision-makers, and again, professional marketing plays a key role.

Seriously, this is a very simple concept: Why are we giving professional marketing work to people who aren't trained or equipped for the job?

The only answer I see is that our leaders don't understand marketing, and I'm not surprised. For years people thought Himalayan Salt came from India... No wonder.
 

Bossman

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First, I said B2G -- Business-to-Government.

Second, it's not 'criticism for the sake of criticizing'. We are dealing with inaccurate JF-17 specs by PAC; weird features like "provision for optional pilot" in the Shahpar-2 sheet; and other weird stuff that shows us a lack of quality controls in our marketing work. Some decision-makers are going to see those sheets and conclude, "yeah these guys aren't serious." If that's the view they have, then that's it, our product isn't going to get evaluated.

Third, the point I made was not about the evaluation process, but actually getting invited into that discussion in the first place. How do you think that happens? It happens when you get on the minds of the decision-makers, and again, professional marketing plays a key role.

Seriously, this is a very simple concept: Why are we giving professional marketing work to people who aren't trained or equipped for the job?

The only answer I see is that our leaders don't understand marketing, and I'm not surprised. For years people thought Himalayan Salt came from India... No wonder.
Stay on the point of Shahpar video. Mixing salt is not relevant. Why do all major Western defense manufacturing companies hire ex military men to be their marketing reps?

who in Pakistan is more qualified? Do you know who does the media campaigns for PAF? Learn a few things and then come back. Live outside of the virtual world and deal with reality for a change.

Despite all their issues, moving up in Pakistan’s military hierarchy or for that matter even civil service is so competitive that the stupid ones get left behind very early. It’s is a different matter that the ones at the top might not have the interest of the country at heart. My question is what have the likes of you achieved or competed against to prove that you are smarter than others and it gives your kind to pretend to be someone you are not and criticize all achievements in Pakistan? Those achievements have been made against odd you cannot ever imagine.

please educate yourself. Opinions without education is the borderline with stupidity.

what you see on such forums is about 2 inches deep the reality is about 6 feet deep. So keep on digging.
 
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Pappa Alpha

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To make good videos, you need to have actual combat footage. Duh! So many geniuses bickering about footage without realizing the potential achievement. Sad to see this thread being polluted like this.

Anyways, once they are successfully used in combat then they will sell themselves.
 

Bilal Khan (Quwa)

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Stay on the point of Shahpar video. Why does all major Western defense manufacturing companies hire ex military man to be their marketing reps?
Here we go...

None of the major Western defence manufacturing firms hire ex-military guys to do graphic design, copywriting, video creation, digital campaigns, designing pavilions, creating brochures, web design, and so on. I've been to multiple defence exhibitions and can tell you that the senior sales reps at LM, Boeing, Dassault, BAE, General Dynamics, etc, are also professional salespeople who've worked 10-15+ years at Microsoft, Dell, GE, BP, Shell, etc and not ex-military guys or serving military guys.

who in Pakistan is more qualified? Do you know who does the media campaigns for PAF? Learn a few things and then come back.
Actually, I do know who runs the media campaigns for the PAF. However, I also know that 100% of the marketing output isn't their fault because, at the end of the day, the people above them don't understand marketing enough to let them do a good job.

I'll give you a story from a past marketing person at the PAF. This person advised AHQ to contract a professional video team and some time on the C-130 or CN235 to take aerial footage of the F-16 and JF-17. AHQ said no. Then, some months later, AHQ let a Chinese team do exactly that thing and the result was the following:


This is how we treat competent people from within the armed forces. No surprise. Again, we can't even sell our own salt without India claiming it's theirs, the rest doesn't surprise me. The fact that the marketing work didn't go to a professional team was a bad decision. Full stop.
 
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Pakistan Space Agency

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So many drones in Pakistani militsry's inventory that don't seem to be deterring terrorism in the country.

The clever ones say, we can't reveal their supremacy in action while the fat Generals moan about why their success story isn't being told to the world.

There is something wrong in the system.
 

R Wing

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Would have loved to see it hit a fast moving target.
Here we go...

None of the major Western defence manufacturing firms hire ex-military guys to do graphic design, copywriting, video creation, digital campaigns, designing pavilions, creating brochures, web design, and so on. I've been to multiple defence exhibitions and can tell you that the senior sales reps at LM, Boeing, Dassault, BAE, General Dynamics, etc, are also professional salespeople who've worked 10-15+ years at Microsoft, Dell, GE, BP, Shell, etc and not ex-military guys or serving military guys.


Actually, I do know who runs the media campaigns for the PAF. However, I also know that 100% of the marketing output isn't their fault because, at the end of the day, the people above them don't understand marketing enough to let them do a good job.

I'll give you a story from a past marketing person at the PAF. This person advised AHQ to contract a professional video team and some time on the C-130 or CN235 to take aerial footage of the F-16 and JF-17. AHQ said no. Then, some months later, AHQ let a Chinese team do exactly that thing and the result was the following:


This is how we treat competent people from within the armed forces. No surprise. Again, we can't even sell our own salt without India claiming it's theirs, the rest doesn't surprise me. The fact that the marketing work didn't go to a professional team was a bad decision. Full stop.
What do you mean?! How dare you discredit the genius faujis on this forum?! Some mod will soon warn you!

They are the best at:
-creative intelligence ops
-grand strategy
-political engineering
-graphic design
-scriptwriting
-directing
-talk show analysis
-acquiring decisions
-management of national defense tech / space / etc agencies

Can't you see? They've fixed and cleansed our system of rotten eggs and leeches internally (corrupt elements) and put India on the backfoot externally.
 

sparten

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Exactly. It's not that the other companies' videos are 'slick' -- they just seem like that. Rather, they're better structured and do a solid job presenting the benefits of their solutions than we do with our goods. Contrast this with Baykar who's showing the TB2 in actual real-world combat scenarios and then still explaining the merits of the solution.

If left to us Pakistanis, we'd just say, "it's combat-proven" and expect the buyer to fill in the gaps on their own. No mention of # of sorties, # of successful strikes, a strike-rate %, night-vs-day strikes %, # of theaters deployed, and so on. Instead of proofing our arguments, we Pakistanis retreat to the, "you figure it out" mentality.

Finally, the decision-makers involved in buying equipment are also getting younger. I think Millennials are now breaching Lt. Col-stage; meaning, they're involved in the assessment at some level. Give it another 10-15 years, and they're 1-Star generals. They'll expect key information in different ways starting with actually being told, in clear terms, why Shahpar-2 et.al is a great solution. That starts with well-produced videos that do more "showing" and less "telling."
Here is a good rule of thumb. If something’s seems obvious to you as a layman, but professionals aren’t doing it, then there must be a damn good reason for it.
Where do you think we use these weapons? Afghanistan. Baluchistan. Where do we get regular international admonishments for acting? Afghanistan, Baluchistan.
N(on And you want us to hand over UHD videos to our enemies to beat us with? I can imagine the headlines now
“HORRIFYING gun camera footage exposes Pakistan’s genocidal campaign against the Baloch”.
“Islamabad Games. Pakistan military Drones provide air support to Taliban. Western experts say is latest example of radicalization”.
 

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