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China's Z-10 helicopters: US firm admits it screwed up

Contract Killer

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A US-based company and its Canadian subsidiary today pleaded guilty to the charges of helping China develop a new attack helicopter and agreed to pay a penalty of $75 million as part of the settlement.

At a federal court hearing in Bridgeport, Conn., United Technologies and its two subsidiaries, Pratt & Whitney Canada [ Images ] and Hamilton Sundstrand Corp, pleaded guilty to violating Arms Export Control Act and making false statements in connection with its export to China of US-origin military software used in China's first modern military attack helicopter the Z-10.

In addition, they all agreed to pay more than $75 million as part of a global settlement with the Justice Department and State Department.

Dating back to the 1980s, China sought to develop a military attack helicopter.

Beginning in the 1990s, after Congress had imposed the prohibition on exports to China, China sought to develop its attack helicopter under the guise of a civilian medium helicopter program in order to secure Western assistance, said the US Immigration and Customs Enforcement's (ICE).

During the development phases of China's Z-10 program, each Z-10 helicopter was powered by engines supplied by PWC. PWC delivered 10 of these development engines to China in 2001 and 2002.

Despite the military nature of the Z-10 helicopter, PWC determined on its own that these development engines for the Z-10 did not constitute "defence articles," requiring a US export license, because they were identical to those engines PWC was already supplying China for a commercial helicopter.

ICE said on Thursday that the Z-10 helicopter is in production and initial batches were delivered to the People's Liberation Army of China in 2009 and 2010.

The primary mission of the Z-10 is anti-armour and battlefield interdiction. Weapons of the Z-10 have included 30 mm cannons, anti-tank guided missiles, air-to-air missiles and unguided rockets.

"PWC exported controlled US technology to China, knowing it would be used in the development of a military attack helicopter in violation of the US arms embargo with China," said US Attorney David Fein.

"PWC took what it described internally as a 'calculated risk,' because it wanted to become the exclusive supplier for a civil helicopter market in China with projected revenues of up to two billion dollars. Several years after the violations were known, UTC, HSC and PWC disclosed the violations to the government and made false statements in doing so," he said.

"Due in part to the efforts of these companies, China was able to develop its first modern military attack helicopter with restricted US defence technology," said Assistant Attorney General Lisa Monaco.

According to ICE, because the electronic engine control software, made by HSC in the United States to test and operate the PWC engines, was modified for a military helicopter application, it was a defence article and required a US export license.

Still, PWC knowingly and willfully caused this software to be exported to China for the Z-10 without any US export license.

In 2002 and 2003, PWC caused six versions of the military software to be illegally exported from HSC in the United States to PWC in Canada, and then to China, where it was used in the PWC engines for the Z-10, it said.

According to court documents, PWC knew from the start of the Z-10 project in 2000 that the Chinese were developing an attack helicopter and that supplying it with US-origin components would be illegal.

When the Chinese claimed that a civil version of the helicopter would be developed in parallel, PWC marketing personnel expressed scepticism internally about the "sudden appearance" of the civil program, the timing of which they questioned as "real or imagined."

In a statement Assistant Secretary Shapiro, of the State Department's Bureau of Political-Military Affairs, said: "Today's $75 million settlement with United Technologies Corporation sends a clear message: willful violators of US arms export control regulations will be pursued and punished. The successful resolution of this case is the byproduct of the tireless work of our compliance officers and highlights the relentless commitment of the State Department to protect sensitive American technologies from being illegally transferred."
China's Z-10 helicopters: US firm admits it screwed up - Rediff.com India News

Seems nothing is indigenous in Chinese military tech. Almost all is Stolen or copied tech.
 

kawaraj

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what a troll thread, meaningless. flaming bait itself.

stealing tech sometimes can be good for human civilization. and the US stole all the techs and work in progress stuff from Nazi Germany. SU did their grabs too.

In China's case I would justify it as the US has put up tech embargo for more than 60 years, (can you imagine that, inhuman indeed?), so the only way for China to develop itself is through some ways aside from buying these techs. the west also took China's tech in pre-modern history for free, as Iv seen on the forum days ago.Stealing resources, relics and raping innocent women is justifed, as we've seen in Iraqi war and Afghanistan war?

What would India do if you are sanctioned, wait there for rotting you feet? And we've seen enough report of Indian espionage in US media, you want me to share the link?
 

karan21

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first of all all big countries and multi billion corporations steal secrets of each others and especially competitors. how do we know that india has never stolen any tech. the nuclear subs india is building is just reverse engineered charlie class. the crogenic engines of india are all reverse engineered from russian engines. its not easy to develop cutting edge tech under sanctions. all smart countries violate laws and find their ways to get the job done somehow. so does china. so just go with it.
 

Contract Killer

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what a troll thread, meaningless. flaming bait itself.

stealing tech sometimes can be good for human civilization. and the US stole all the techs and work in progress stuff from Nazi Germany. SU did their grabs too.

In China's case I would justify it as the US has put up tech embargo for more than 60 years, (can you imagine that, inhuman indeed?), so the only way for China to develop itself is through some ways aside from buying these techs. the west also took China's tech in pre-modern history for free, as Iv seen on the forum days ago.Stealing resources, relics and raping innocent women is justifed, as we've seen in Iraqi war and Afghanistan war?

What would India do if you are sanctioned, wait there for rotting you feet? And we've seen enough report of Indian espionage in US media, you want me to share the link?

So just because US stole tech from Nazi, hence it becomes ethical for china to steal??

Ok if you have stolen it, at least don't claim it to be indigenous.

In a country you find few people as thieves or looters............... but in the case of China, its a country which is doing this.

And you are free to share details about tech stolen by India.

and also keep in mind............. that even India had sanctions from US for many many years, but that did not make us steal.

what a troll thread, meaningless. flaming bait itself.

stealing tech sometimes can be good for human civilization. and the US stole all the techs and work in progress stuff from Nazi Germany. SU did their grabs too.

In China's case I would justify it as the US has put up tech embargo for more than 60 years, (can you imagine that, inhuman indeed?), so the only way for China to develop itself is through some ways aside from buying these techs. the west also took China's tech in pre-modern history for free, as Iv seen on the forum days ago.Stealing resources, relics and raping innocent women is justifed, as we've seen in Iraqi war and Afghanistan war?

What would India do if you are sanctioned, wait there for rotting you feet? And we've seen enough report of Indian espionage in US media, you want me to share the link?

So just because US stole tech from Nazi, hence it becomes ethical for china to steal??

Ok if you have stolen it, at least don't claim it to be indigenous.

In a country you find few people as thieves or looters............... but in the case of China, its a country which is doing this.

And you are free to share details about tech stolen by India.

and also keep in mind............. that even India had sanctions from US for many many years, but that did not make us steal.
 

gowthamraj

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^ is there no limit for cheerleading:undecided:

The question here is why china stealing tech. I agree its good for developing countries .

But why the hell they need to spread the progapanda that China innovates every thing militarily and commercially and russia and US are technologically inferior to them:/
 

Contract Killer

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first of all all big countries and multi billion corporations steal secrets of each others and especially competitors. how do we know that india has never stolen any tech. the nuclear subs india is building is just reverse engineered charlie class. the crogenic engines of india are all reverse engineered from russian engines. its not easy to develop cutting edge tech under sanctions. all smart countries violate laws and find their ways to get the job done somehow. so does china. so just go with it.

Some links to justify your claims pls.
 

Contract Killer

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^ is there no limit for cheerleading:undecided:

The question here is why china stealing tech. I agree its good for developing countries .

But why the hell they need to spread the progapanda that China innovates every thing militarily and commercially and russia and US are technologically inferior to them:/

I totally agree with you.

agreed they need to safe guard there country and its interest. Even by the means of stealing tech, does not matters.

But at least don't boast, that we did this, we did that by our own.

We are falana - dimkana, and what not.
 

sweetgrape

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hehe, Then india idiot open a idiotic thread again!! and add a idiot sentence in the end, that sentence make me laugh!!
after 30 years, Indian idiot still spend much energy on their LCA and arjun, and till now, they can't finish these projects, at the same time, china have manufactured JH7, J8, J10A, J10B, J11A, and now, J15, J16, J20 and other unrevealed plane, what about you indian idiot?
Yes, our plane is not indigenous completely, tell me what about? no matther what's our weapon, Yes, it can't compare with Western and Russia, but, they are much better than your "indegineous" weapon. stealing? just reading the article indiot moron, we have pay for it, we just use these merchant, why should we feel shameful? It is you that should feel shameful!! don't live in the daydream, idiot, it is modern time now, espionage is everywhere!!! are you naive or childish?
SUCH you kind of idiot only have big month. Enjoy defecating in the public in your country!
 

Srinivas

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hehe, Then india idiot open a idiotic thread again!! and add a idiot sentence in the end, that sentence make me laugh!!
after 30 years, Indian idiot still spend much energy on their LCA and arjun, and till now, they can't finish these projects, at the same time, china have manufactured JH7, J8, J10A, J10B, J11A, and now, J15, J16, J20 and other unrevealed plane, what about you indian idiot?
Yes, our plane is not indigenous completely, tell me what about? no matther what's our weapon, Yes, it can't compare with Western and Russia, but, they are much better than your "indegineous" weapon. stealing? just reading the article indiot moron, we have pay for it, we just use these merchant, why should we feel shameful? It is you that should feel shameful!! don't live in the daydream, idiot, it is modern time now, espionage is everywhere!!! are you naive or childish?
SUCH you kind of idiot only have big month. Enjoy defecating in the public in your country!

Is it a post or some kind of phobia, you will get each time Chinese are exposed.
 

Hack-Hook

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Well , I don't see any stealing , American themselves exported the software in hope of a 2bn $ benefit later . how its stealing is out of my understanding.
 

Contract Killer

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hehe, Then india idiot open a idiotic thread again!! and add a idiot sentence in the end, that sentence make me laugh!!
after 30 years, Indian idiot still spend much energy on their LCA and arjun, and till now, they can't finish these projects, at the same time, china have manufactured JH7, J8, J10A, J10B, J11A, and now, J15, J16, J20 and other unrevealed plane, what about you indian idiot?
Yes, our plane is not indigenous completely, tell me what about? no matther what's our weapon, Yes, it can't compare with Western and Russia, but, they are much better than your "indegineous" weapon. stealing? just reading the article indiot moron, we have pay for it, we just use these merchant, why should we feel shameful? It is you that should feel shameful!! don't live in the daydream, idiot, it is modern time now, espionage is everywhere!!! are you naive or childish?
SUCH you kind of idiot only have big month. Enjoy defecating in the public in your country!


Hehe..... your grapes have gone sour.

Its also stinking.

there is nothing indigenous in JH7, J8, J10A, J10B, J11A, J12A, THEN J15, 16, 17 UPTILL 20. It all painting job or copy paste of stealing of tech.

I know your head is not buried in shame. as it is in blood of chinese now. And for them there is nothing wrong in it. For them stealing is art of high IQ head.

Well , I don't see any stealing , American themselves exported the software in hope of a 2bn $ benefit later . how its stealing is out of my understanding.

Did china declare that it is using it for its Military project?

If yes, then its not stealing.

If no, even then it is not actually stealing, but is CHEATING.

and Cheating is also and unethical practise.
 

Matrixx

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hehe, Then india idiot open a idiotic thread again!! and add a idiot sentence in the end, that sentence make me laugh!!
after 30 years, Indian idiot still spend much energy on their LCA and arjun, and till now, they can't finish these projects, at the same time, china have manufactured JH7, J8, J10A, J10B, J11A, and now, J15, J16, J20 and other unrevealed plane, what about you indian idiot?
Yes, our plane is not indigenous completely, tell me what about? no matther what's our weapon, Yes, it can't compare with Western and Russia, but, they are much better than your "indegineous" weapon. stealing? just reading the article indiot moron, we have pay for it, we just use these merchant, why should we feel shameful? It is you that should feel shameful!! don't live in the daydream, idiot, it is modern time now, espionage is everywhere!!! are you naive or childish?
SUCH you kind of idiot only have big month. Enjoy defecating in the public in your country!

If India would have cheated like CHina, India would have finish those project long....

Hehe..... your grapes have gone sour.

Its also stinking.

there is nothing indigenous in JH7, J8, J10A, J10B, J11A, J12A, THEN J15, 16, 17 UPTILL 20. It all painting job or copy paste of stealing of tech.

I know your head is not buried in shame. as it is in blood of chinese now. And for them there is nothing wrong in it. For them stealing is art of high IQ head.



Did china declare that it is using it for its Military project?

If yes, then its not stealing.

If no, even then it is not actually stealing, but is CHEATING.

and Cheating is also and unethical practise.

So world know that it is not only Fake China....It is Cheat China also....:bunny::china::bunny:
 

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