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China seems to have figured out how to make 7nm chips despite US sanctions

tonyget

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Let me get this straight...the US supplies key components/tech to ASML's machines..and ASML is going to ban selling these machines back to the US.

How can they ban machines they wont be able to make?

Do you have evidence that ASML can not find alternatives suppliers for these components?Because no company(Apple in particular) like the idea of sole supplier for obvious reason,they always have some backup plans in order to maintain bargaining power over supplier.
 

ChineseTiger1986

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LOL! You are only using DC because you simply don't have the nuclear power generating capabilities to support 4 catapults using AC.

Fujian uses two nuclear reactors to support its propulsion and daily life of the sailors.

But its EMALS and AAG are supported by the advanced IEP system.

Hence it looks like a conventional supercarrier with funnel structure, because all IEP systems are conventional.
 

tower9

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The best academic talent are Chinese. With the lost of Chinese talent serving America, US is bound to fall behind China. While China just need to ensure its talent are retain will maintain the edge over US.
China is a major source of talent for the US, but certainly not the only one or even the majority. With less talent sourcing from China, the US will still have many other sources where they can get great talent from South Asia, Southeast Asia, ex-Soviet countries, Europe, Middle East, etc.

Don't underestimate the ability of the US to attract talent worldwide. China is seriously lacking in this department and I don't see it catching up soon unless there is a significant revolution culturally and politically which will make China a much more attractive place for foreigners to live in.
 

Hamartia Antidote

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I'm not expert on this,but do you have any source/research to prove that AC is batter than DC for this EM application?

DC power is much more efficient than AC however AC tends to have more engine Torque abilities. Obviously torque isn't going to matter to EMALS but this limited capacity for AC production was why China switched from an AC system to a DC system.

"China has reportedly achieved a breakthrough on a conventional propulsion system for its next carrier, which would allow it to operate advanced catapults for launching aircraft without necessitating the use of nuclear propulsion.

Hong Kong’s South China Morning Post newspaper, quoting sources close to China’s People’s Liberation Army, reported that a team led by China’s top naval engineer, Rear Adm. Ma Weiming, has developed a medium-voltage, direct-current transmission network to replace an earlier system based on alternating current.."
 

ChineseTiger1986

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Let me get this straight...the US supplies key components/tech to ASML's machines..and ASML is going to ban selling these machines back to the US.

How can they ban machines they wont be able to make?

That's why ASML will be dead within few years.

The taking-down-China obsession by the US has wreaked havoc across the world.

You gonna do this at any cost, and all your allies will get destroyed by you one by one.
 

Hamartia Antidote

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Or maybe we don't really need nuclear powered carrier right now? Nuclear power could well be a huge disadvantage because no matter where the carrier got hitted by a missile,there would be a great danger that nuclear leakage would ruin the whole ship and soldiers for ever?

Uh huh..I suggest you scrap all your nuclear powered submarines...and remove the missiles too.

Nuclear power allows carriers/submarines to cross oceans at sustained high speed.
 

etylo

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China is a major source of talent for the US, but certainly not the only one or even the majority. With less talent sourcing from China, the US will still have many other sources where they can get great talent from South Asia, Southeast Asia, ex-Soviet countries, Europe, Middle East, etc.

Don't underestimate the ability of the US to attract talent worldwide. China is seriously lacking in this department and I don't see it catching up soon unless there is a significant revolution culturally and politically which will make China a much more attractive place for foreigners to live in.
China doesn't need to be another USA competing to be the most comsopolitan nation to import large number of immigrants and workers, otherwise it will be disastrous and chaotic for the country. China just have to make good use of all the native talents in the country and China should be up there. China now is graduating more than 15 times the number of STEM students of USA every year.
 
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Hamartia Antidote

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Do you have evidence that ASML can not find alternatives suppliers for these components?Because no company(Apple in particular) like the idea of sole supplier for obvious reason,they always have some backup plans in order to maintain bargaining power over supplier.

We own some of the technology. This isn't a simple outsourcing issue. It would be a licensing issue.

Alot of systems these days are built simply due to various companies having achieved small successes in a technology that when combined with successes by other companies ends up building a greater success. Like ASML's machines.
 

tower9

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China doesn't need to be another USA to import large number of immigrants and workers, otherwise it will be disastrous and chaotic for the country. China just have to make good use of all the native talents in the country and China should be up there. China now is graduating more than 15 times the number of STEM students of USA every year.

Importing highly skilled and educated people are a boon, it is not disastrous. It is disastrous if you are importing massive amounts of poor and ill educated people who will not learn to assimilate into your society.

Also, China is about 20% of the world's population and that portion will keep shrinking. If you are satisfied with only drawing talent from 20% of humanity while the US draws from 80%, then that's delusional.
 

etylo

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Importing highly skilled and educated people are a boon, it is not disastrous. It is disastrous if you are importing massive amounts of poor and ill educated people who will not learn to assimilate into your society.

Also, China is about 20% of the world's population and that portion will keep shrinking. If you are satisfied with only drawing talent from 20% of humanity while the US draws from 80%, then that's delusional.
Importing specialized talents needed in the particular fields should be OK. I am not saying that China should all close off to needed talents. China just should not aspire to be another USA in many respects. China is already overcrowded and overpopulated.

Plus, it's not the other 80% talents of the world, most of the world population are in third world countries and their education is not up to the standards of China and USA, they can't possibly produce that many talents.

Not every other talent or every person on the earth esp Europeans want to live or work in the US too. So, US can't possibly attract all the rest of world talents outside China.
 
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onebyone

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China’s top chip maker SMIC may have achieved tech breakthrough, experts say​

  • Researchers at a Canadian tech analysis firm concluded that Shanghai-based SMIC has been able to produce 7-nanometre chips since last year
  • SMIC’s advanced capability would put the company ahead of American and European peers, but it could also spur further US sanctions, analysts say
  • 1658850180494.png
  • A Chinese flag near a logo atop the Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corp (SMIC) headquarters in Shanghai. Photo: Bloomberg
    China’s top chip maker has likely gained the ability to produce 7-nanometre chips, according to a Canadian tech analysis firm, marking a significant breakthrough as the world’s second-largest economy pushes towards technological self-sufficiency to counter US sanctions.
    Researchers at TechInsights made the conclusion after they reverse-engineered a sample chip made by Semiconductor Manufacturing International Corp (SMIC), extracted from a cryptocurrency mining machine.
    Analysts and industry professionals believe it is technically possible for SMIC to produce 7nm chips with existing deep ultraviolet (DUV) systems, under the leadership of co-CEO Liang Mong Song, a chip-making expert who was previously an executive at industry-leading Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co.

  • https://www.scmp.com/tech/big-tech/...aker-smic-may-have-achieved-tech-breakthrough

 

Viet

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It doesn't matter whether we can or cannot, at least we try. The effort alone scares the West. 10 years ago, nobody would've believed what we achieved today. China is heading the right way, thats why the West is shivering. You and I both know this. We Hans had been surviving for 5000 years, been through hell and heaven, war and peace, you think we won't survive another 1000 years? We are the second most powerful nation on earth.

1) when you denied us entry into ISS, we kept quiet, grind our teeth and built our own.

2) when you sanctioned us militarily, we kept quiet, grind our teeth and made our own weapons.

3) when you denied us access to semicon equipment, we kept quiet, grinded our teeth and is building our own.

4) you said our trains were crap and slow, we built the worlds largest hsr network.

5) you said our deserts were expanding, we built the worlds largest forest.

6) you said we emit the most greenhouse gas without thinking we produce those gas due to manufacturing for the world. We built the world's largest green energy system.

7) you said our cars suck, we built the best battery technology for the next generation EVs.

8) you said our carriers are junk, we built the new EMALS carrier.

You see a patten here? This is the stubborn Han you are talking about. We fight! We might be quiet and look docile, but deep within all Chinese is an anger to reclaim our God given right in this world and the lost glory of the Huaxia civilization. Remember we are not just a country, we are oldest surviving Civilization on this sweet earth.
Yes China can be, China may be.
At the moment I don’t feel chinese much here I see around me those chinese items:
- tower ventilator
- TV drama
- corona test kits
- tiktok videos
Ok my iphone comes from China. My Hp laptop comes from China. However those are US origins. My car needs gasoline it comes from Russia. That’s it.
 

Beast

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China is a major source of talent for the US, but certainly not the only one or even the majority. With less talent sourcing from China, the US will still have many other sources where they can get great talent from South Asia, Southeast Asia, ex-Soviet countries, Europe, Middle East, etc.

Don't underestimate the ability of the US to attract talent worldwide. China is seriously lacking in this department and I don't see it catching up soon unless there is a significant revolution culturally and politically which will make China a much more attractive place for foreigners to live in.
I think you forget one important factor. China has a proud heritage and long history which US are lacking. Many scientist goes to US for fund, fame and condition for their research. But not a single scientist do research in US for its proud history or even do work there with limited salary or lower condition.

Nan Rendong come back to China to continue his dream for China, not for fame, not for money or personal gain. They come back to do their scientist work becos they want to do something for China. Such scientist mentality equals top 10 scientist working in US. This is something US can never compete with China even they can attract some overseas Chinese scientist. And the lost of such scientist working for them but instead for China, is a big deprived for US.

You will be surprised how much scientific contribution are by Chinese scientist for US.
 

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