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Chengdu J-20 5th Generation Aircraft News & Discussions

Figaro

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I think china can probably do better than j20, maybe stall till next generation?
The J-20 is the best aircraft possible to meet China's 5th generation requirements ... this was why it was chosen as the PLAAF fifth generation fighter back in 2007, because it not only met all the design requirements but also exceeded them.
 

kungfugymnast

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I think china can probably do better than j20, maybe stall till next generation?
Right now China focus is on perfecting the WS15, come up with navalized J-35 and put the Type 003 into active service to protect China shores and seas engaging enemies beyond missiles effective range.

The large heavy fighter bomber is latter project. In future, medium & long range stealth bombers (known as heavy fighter bomber) will be fitted with AESA radar carrying air to air missiles, air to ground and ALCM for intercontinental warfare. US FB-22/23, B-1R is part of such project and China is getting into such race trying to be ahead of US.

Stealth bomber B-2 without air to air capability is defenseless left at mercy of enemy fighters if spotted by satellite. Even old Mig-21 could take sweet time to intercept scaring the B-2 pilot forcing him to land if doesn't want to try the 23mm rounds
 

Figaro

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Why j20 need those ventral fins
A very good answer.

Why does the J-20 need two ventral fins even though Russian and US stealth fighters like the Su-57 PAK FA, F-22, and F-35 do not?

I’m assuming you mean those small ones at the rear.

Ventral fins like those ones are usually implemented because of one of several reasons.

First is that it can potentially yield an improvement in turbulent airflow, potentially increasing back pressure. This lowers drag overall, and helps increase speed slightly.

The second reason is that they can alter airflow, potentially improving tail control authority and efficiency, mostly in the pitch axis.

The third reason they might be installed is the aircraft is simply too stable. In these cases, it’s because the jet suffer’s from rolling difficulties. It’s used to help boost agility.

The final reason a jet might have them is that the jet is too unstable, particularly with it’s yaw. It’s done as way of improving stability, and allowing the jet to be more easily kept flying in a straight line.

All in all, I would say that reason four might be the most likely one. The J-20’s a very unstable design to begin with, thanks to it’s canard delta configuration.

Stealth aircraft also tend to benefit from minimizing control surface movements during flight, since this mitigates changes in their planform alignment. So, an airframe with a very low degree of yaw stability runs into a number of challenges in staying stealthy. Adding ventral fins help to mitigate this yaw instability, improving stealth. The fact that the ventral fins are also placed at the same angle as the dorsal fin on the opposing side means that they maintain planform alignment for the airframe.

Overall, they likely help deal with a high degree of existing yaw instability, and improve stealth as a result of correcting this issue.
Yaw instability has not been a major problem in previous stealth designs, though nobody has attempted to build a stealth fighter that relies on a canard delta configuration either.


 

obj 705A

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I think china can probably do better than j20, maybe stall till next generation?
I have a feeling the final J-31 will become more advanced & perfected than the J-20, and will end up becoming the main fighter of not just the PLAN but also the PLAAF. The J-20 was China's first ever stealth aircraft, even though both were competing at the same time & the J-20 won. the J-31 went through drastic changes since then and the experience they got from the J-20 & the first variant of the J-31 became like a stepping stone towards developing a perfect J-31/J-35.
 

LKJ86

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I have a feeling the final J-31 will become more advanced & perfected than the J-20, and will end up becoming the main fighter of not just the PLAN but also the PLAAF. The J-20 was China's first ever stealth aircraft, even though both were competing at the same time & the J-20 won. the J-31 went through drastic changes since then and the experience they got from the J-20 & the first variant of the J-31 became like a stepping stone towards developing a perfect J-31/J-35.
Funny...
Why do you think J-20 can't be evloving with the times?
The production of F-22 has stopped, but J-20 not.
 

Figaro

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I have a feeling the final J-31 will become more advanced & perfected than the J-20, and will end up becoming the main fighter of not just the PLAN but also the PLAAF. The J-20 was China's first ever stealth aircraft, even though both were competing at the same time & the J-20 won. the J-31 went through drastic changes since then and the experience they got from the J-20 & the first variant of the J-31 became like a stepping stone towards developing a perfect J-31/J-35.
No it will not ... how can an aircraft (i.e. the FC-31), whose design was rejected in favor of the J-20 become better than the J-20, especially when it has the full backing of the PLAAF and AVIC? The J-20 is a proven aircraft that is already in operation versus the FC-31 which is still languishing in the prototype phase. Meanwhile, variants of the J-20 are being worked on, with the J-20B or J-20C equipped with WS-15 engines being the most imminent one. There is a reason why the J-20 is not available for export, while the FC-31 is.
 

obj 705A

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Funny...
Why do you think J-20 can't be evloving with the times?
The production of F-22 has stopped, but J-20 not.
Wait when did I ever say the J-20 cannot evolve? we already know there is a new variant j-20B and there will be more enhancement and upgrades in successor variants, but it is exactly because the J-20 is already in production while the J-31 is still not in production that the they can make the kind of drastic changes required to obtain a perfect fighter.
There is a limit to how much you can upgrade and enhance an existing design that is already in production, but there is no such limit on an aircraft that has yet to enter production in is still in development stage.

No it will not ... how can an aircraft (i.e. the FC-31), whose design was rejected in favor of the J-20 become better than the J-20, especially when it has the full backing of the PLAAF and AVIC? The J-20 is a proven aircraft that is already in operation versus the FC-31 which is still languishing in the prototype phase. Meanwhile, variants of the J-20 are being worked on, with the J-20B or J-20C equipped with WS-15 engines being the most imminent one. There is a reason why the J-20 is not available for export, while the FC-31 is.
Languishing in development? I mean we know it is under developmemt but were there actually any news/leaks that said the J-31 is "languishing"!
There is a drastic difference between the current J-31/J-35 and that fighter that lost in the competition, even just by the looks of the aircraft it looks like a new fighter different from the FC-31, that is how much they could change it.
 

LKJ86

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Wait when did I ever say the J-20 cannot evolve? we already know there is a new variant j-20B and there will be more enhancement and upgrades in successor variants, but it is exactly because the J-20 is already in production while the J-31 is still not in production that the they can make the kind of drastic changes required to obtain a perfect fighter.
There is a limit to how much you can upgrade and enhance an existing design that is already in production, but there is no such limit on an aircraft that has yet to enter production in is still in development stage.
As we know, the later JF-17 has benefited from the development of J-10.
Do you think JF-17 BLK III would perform better than J-10C?
 

LKJ86

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Wait when did I ever say the J-20 cannot evolve? we already know there is a new variant j-20B and there will be more enhancement and upgrades in successor variants, but it is exactly because the J-20 is already in production while the J-31 is still not in production that the they can make the kind of drastic changes required to obtain a perfect fighter.
There is a limit to how much you can upgrade and enhance an existing design that is already in production, but there is no such limit on an aircraft that has yet to enter production in is still in development stage.



Languishing in development? I mean we know it is under developmemt but were there actually any news/leaks that said the J-31 is "languishing"!
There is a drastic difference between the current J-31/J-35 and that fighter that lost in the competition, even just by the looks of the aircraft it looks like a new fighter different from the FC-31, that is how much they could change it.
Only if FC-31/J-35 is desgined to be a 6th-generation fighter jet from the beginning, you would be right, and FC-31/J-35 can perform better that the 5th-generation J-20.
 

UKBengali

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No it will not ... how can an aircraft (i.e. the FC-31), whose design was rejected in favor of the J-20 become better than the J-20, especially when it has the full backing of the PLAAF and AVIC? The J-20 is a proven aircraft that is already in operation versus the FC-31 which is still languishing in the prototype phase. Meanwhile, variants of the J-20 are being worked on, with the J-20B or J-20C equipped with WS-15 engines being the most imminent one. There is a reason why the J-20 is not available for export, while the FC-31 is.
Pretty irrelevant as by the mid-2030s a far more advanced 6th gen fighter will start joining the PLAAF.


FC-31 will only be coming into service in the second half of this decade
and so not many years before China's 6th gen fighter.
 

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