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'Beijing-Dhaka ties will be substantially damaged if Bangladesh joins Quad'

DalalErMaNodi

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India is more than capable to arm twist BD militarily or diplomatically depending on their mood.
BD can push towards china, but that will cause a devastating response from India. The same thing will happen if BD swing towards india.

You cannot say no to anyone here, nor can you say yes. This not a business meeting . Rather military alliance in the making.

The best thing for BD is to remain secular and neutral. No angering anyone. Just focusing on development, especially military. But the biggest question is can BD maintain her neutrality ?

MR momen is on the money here . He wants what is best for his country.


Your GOB is talking in line with what I have just said: BD must not choose any side between QUAD or China. Stay neutral.

It is your over enthusiastic country men who are jumping up and down, pretending to be great game players.

Nobody is pretending that Bangladesh is some big game player, nobody even said so, it's just you telling us we are not, while trying to hint the opposite for yourself...


It's okay, we can read between the lines ..



End of story.
Cheers.
 

fallstuff

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চীনা রাষ্ট্রদূতের মন্তব্যে বিস্মিত কূটনীতিকরা

যুক্তরাষ্ট্র, ভারত, অস্ট্রেলিয়া ও জাপানের সমন্বয়ে গঠিত জোট কোয়াডে যোগ দিলে ঢাকা-বেইজিং দ্বিপক্ষীয় সম্পর্কের ক্ষতি হবে বলে মন্তব্য করেছেন চীনের রাষ্ট্রদূত লি জিমিং। সোমবার (১০ মে) ডিপ্লোম্যাটিক করেসপন্ডেন্ট অ্যাসোসিয়েশনের আয়োজিত এক অনুষ্ঠানে তিনি এসব কথা বলেন।

রাষ্ট্রদূত লি জিমিংয়ের এমন মন্তব্যে কিছুটা বিস্মিত করেছে কূটনীতি বিশেষজ্ঞদের। তাদের বক্তব্য, কোয়াডে যোগ দেওয়ার বিষয়ে বাংলাদেশকে কেউ আহ্বান জানায়নি, ঢাকাও এ বিষয়ে কখনও আগ্রহ দেখায়নি। এই প্রেক্ষিতে লি জিমিং কেন এই মন্তব্য করলেন সেটি নিয়ে সন্দিহান তারা।

এ বিষয়ে জানতে চাইলে সাবেক পররাষ্ট্র সচিব শহীদুল হক কোয়াডে বাংলাদেশের যোগদানে অনাগ্রহের বিষয় উল্লেখ করে বাংলা ট্রিবিউনকে বলেন, ‘আমার জানামতে কোনও ধরনের সামরিক জোটে যোগ দেওয়ার জন্য বাংলাদেশ কখনও আলোচনা করেছে বা আগ্রহ দেখিয়েছে, এমন কোনও ঘটনা ঘটেনি।’

চীনে বাংলাদেশের সাবেক রাষ্ট্রদূত মুনশি ফায়েজ আহমেদ বলেন, ‘কোয়াডে যোগ দেবে এ ধরনের কিছু কখনই বাংলাদেশ থেকে বলা হয়নি। বাংলাদেশ ফ্রি অ্যান্ড ওপেন ইন্দো-প্যাসিফিক ভিশন ধারণ করে এবং সেটিও শুধুমাত্র অর্থনৈতিক অংশটুকু। কোনও ধরনের নিরাপত্তা বিষয়ে আমরা যোগ দেবো না, এটি আমাদের সরকারের পরিষ্কার অবস্থান।’

অন্যদেশগুলো বাংলাদেশকে কোয়াডে যোগ দিতে বলেছে এধরনের কোনও ইঙ্গিতও আমরা পাইনি জানিয়ে তিনি বলেন, ‘যুক্তরাষ্ট্র বাংলাদেশকে ফ্রি অ্যান্ড ওপেন ইন্দো-প্যাসিফিক ভিশনের বিষয়ে জানিয়েছে কিন্তু কোয়াডে যোগ দেওয়ার বিষয়ে কোনও কথা হয়েছে বলে কখনো শুনিনি।’

তার মতে, চীনের এ বিষয়টি জানা আছে, হয়তো কোয়াড নিয়ে প্রশ্ন করার কারণে তিনি বলেছেন যে কোয়াড জোটটি নির্বিষ নয়। কোয়াডের সদস্যরা প্রকাশ্যেই চীনের বিরোধিতা করছে এবং এ বিষয়টিকে বেইজিংএর ভালো চোখে দেখার কোনও সুযোগ নেই। মুনশি ফায়েজ বলেন, এই ধরনের জোটে বাংলাদেশ বা অন্য কোনও দেশ যোগ দিলে চীন পছন্দ করবে না এটিই স্বাভাবিক এবং এই বার্তাটি তারা দিচ্ছে।

নাম প্রকাশে অনিচ্ছুক একজন কূটনীতিক বাংলা ট্রিবিউনকে বলেন, সাধারণত চীন প্রকাশ্যে কিছু বলে না। এবারেই মনে হয় প্রথম তারা এ ধরনের কথা তারা জনসম্মুখে বললো।

কোয়াড চারটি দেশের একটি জোট এবং তারা নতুন কাউকে নিচ্ছে না জানিয়ে ওই কূটনীতিক বলেন, বাংলাদেশকে কোয়াডে কেউ যোগ দিতে বলছে বলে আমার জানা নেই, সে হিসেবে এই বক্তব্যের প্রয়োজন ছিল না। চীনাদের কেউ ভুল বুঝিয়েছে। তাই তারা বাংলাদেশকে নিয়ে টানাহেঁচড়া করছে।

সবার সঙ্গে সুন্দর ব্যবহারের চীনের যে নজির ছিল বেইজিং সেখান থেকে কিছুটা সরে আসছে জানিয়ে তিনি বলেন, আগে তারা অনেক সতর্ক ছিল কিন্তু এখন এর অভাব দেখা দিচ্ছে। এটি তাদের জন্য ভালো হবে কিনা সেটি ভবিষ্যতে বোঝা যাবে।

ডিপ্লোমেটিক করেসপন্ডেন্ট অ্যাসোসিয়েশনের আয়োজিত এক অনুষ্ঠানে চীনা রাষ্ট্রদূত বলেন, ‌চীন মনে করে কোয়াড একটি গ্রুপ এবং এটি চীনবিরোধী। আমি এটি পরিষ্কার করে বলতে চাই। কোয়াড নিজেকে অর্থনেতিক কাজে সম্পৃক্ত বলে দাবি করে, কিন্তু এটি সত্যি নয়। মূলত কোয়াড করা হয়েছে চীনের বিরোধীতার জন্য।

তিনি বলেন, 'এই চার সদস্য বিশিষ্ট ক্লাবে যোগ দিলে এটি বাংলাদেশের জন্য ভালো হবে না। কারণ এর ফলে চীনের সঙ্গে দ্বিপক্ষীয় সম্পর্ক চরমভাবে ক্ষতিগ্রস্ত হবে।'

এর আগে, ২৭ এপ্রিল চীনের প্রতিরক্ষা মন্ত্রী উই ফেঙ্গে একদিনের জন্য ঢাকা সফরে আসেন। এরআগে, মার্চে ভারতের পররাষ্ট্রমন্ত্রী এস জয়শংকর ও এপ্রিলে ভারতের সেনা প্রধান ঢাকা সফর করেন। জয়শংকর ঢাকায় এসে বঙ্গোপসাগর কেন্দ্রিক সংযুক্তির অর্থাৎ ওই সাগর সন্নিবেশিত ৯টি দেশে চীনের উপস্থিতি কমানোর প্রতি ইঙ্গিত করেছিলেন।

I wonder what was the Chinese ambassador was smoking before he said those things. There are diplomatic channels for issues like this. He is repeating what the Chinese Defense minister was saying.
What was the Chinese Defense Minister doing in BD following Indian General's visit ?

I am not sure Chinese claim of no alliance is true anymore. Perhaps they want an alliance privately, but do not want to say it publicly.



China on Tuesday emphasised the need for Bangladesh to take joint efforts against the formation of a military alliance led by the United States for maintaining ‘hegemony’ in South Asia.

Chinese defence minister General Wei Fenghe put the emphasis in a meeting with president Abdul Hamid in Dhaka on Tuesday.


 

fallstuff

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In my opinion:

1) what formal alliance is BD part of ? If BD allows India to use BD roads and bridges, than BD is part and parcel of the IA. BD and Indian targets will become fair game. Those roads and bridges will be first targets. Quad wont defend BD . You are overplaying BD's importance.

2) Regardless of China can or can't take on Quad, the point to take home is who ever sides with Quad ,China will consider that country enemy. As such will become a target of Chinese weapons during war with Quad, should it happen.

3) No one will want to make that distinction about civilian and military. what ever target they feel will secure their interests. That all that matters.

4) Neutrality is the best and only option. Anything else is absolute disaster. In this instance, I completely agree FM Momen. BD must not pick sides in this feud between Quad and China. Whatever short term gains BD gets, is not worth it in the long term.

5) If you feel BD as a country can freely pursuit and bargain its interest in the international arena without blessing of and/or BD can survive as a nation state after making an enemy of either : USA, China , Russia. Then maybe we should talk about Disney land.

6) this statement by FM Momen is right on the money. BD must remain strictly neutral.

7) Public announcement is not a sign of weakness. Rather , a very formal and public warning. The Chinese also want BD to be neutral in a conflict between China and Quad.

Nobody is pretending that Bangladesh is some big game player, nobody even said so, it's just you telling us we are not, while trying to hint the opposite for yourself...


It's okay, we can read between the lines ..

End of story.
Cheers.
The bombastic tone how China will shower wrath on Bangladesh sounds very similar to what Chinese posters want to do to India and Japan.
 

mike2000 is back

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Momen Kagu already made it quite clrear that we aren't interested in Quad.

View attachment 742350

to be fair, i don't think the US should push Bangladesh into this. The country is still poor underdeveloped country trying to find its way into the 21st century. So i see no point in getting them involved in great power politics. they should focus on their development/lifting their people out of absolute poverty, attracting as much FDI as they can and making themselves an attractive destination for foreign companies looking for cheap/affordable labour to make their products for exports. That should be their focus, just like Vietnam has been focusing on just that and they have been quite successful.
The bombastic tone how China will shower wrath on Bangladesh sounds very similar to what Chinese posters want to do to India and Japan.
LOL Don't the tone too seriously. Rising powers will obviously have a segment of their population with some very nationalistic tendencies. It's normal.
 

Atlas

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China-Bangladesh bilateral ties will be ‘substantially damaged’ if Bangladesh decides to join the US led security alliance Quadrilateral Security Dialogue (Quad) in any form, said Chinese Ambassador in Dhaka Li Jiming today (Monday).
I am wondering why Chinese ambassador even need to say this ? Was Bangladesh planning to join quad(inside the curtain)?

Who knows! It's very hard to understand the mentality of Bangladeshi policy makers ,who's mind is like pendulum,that change side in every seconds.

I hope no policy maker will make treason and will try Bangladesh to join( or even thinking of joining ) in quad!
 
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fallstuff

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to be fair, i don't think the US should push Bangladesh into this. The country is still poor underdeveloped country trying to find its way into the 21st century. So i see no point in getting them involved in great power politics. they should focus on their development/lifting their people out of absolute poverty, attracting as much FDI as they can and making themselves an attractive destination for foreign companies looking for cheap/affordable labour to make their products for exports. That should be their focus, just like Vietnam has been focusing on just that and they have been quite successful.

LOL Don't the tone too seriously. Rising powers will obviously have a segment of their population with some very nationalistic tendencies. It's normal.
Exactly.
There are way too many poor people in BD to take care in BD.
Most of us in the BD section are not big fan of the AL Government in power , but they are handling foreign affairs' well by staying out of these alliances and possible future conflicts.

I think Chinese are being overly concerned that Indian army chief making multiple trips to BD in the last few months.
 

Bilal9

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'Beijing-Dhaka ties will be substantially damaged if Bangladesh joins Quad'



China-Bangladesh bilateral ties will be ‘substantially damaged’ if Bangladesh decides to join the US led security alliance Quadrilateral Security Dialogue (Quad) in any form, said Chinese Ambassador in Dhaka Li Jiming today (Monday).

The message was conveyed to the Bangladesh government by Chinese Defence Minister Wei Fenghe during his recent visit to Dhaka, the Ambassador said.

He was responding to a question during a virtual interaction with the members of the Diplomatic Correspondent’s Association of Bangladesh (DCAB).

Mr Jiming said China sees Quad as an alliance against the country. It is a small club of 4, and we all know what it is for China- and that is why Japan has joined hands with the US, he said.

USA, Japan, Australia and India are the members of Quad, often termed by many as the Asian NATO.

‘We do not want any form of participation of Bangladesh in this alliance,” the Chinese Ambassador made it clear.

Earlier, Chinese officials said that the defence minister during his meeting with Bangladesh President put emphasis on the need for taking joint efforts by China and Bangladesh against the formation of a military alliance led by the United States for maintaining ‘hegemony’ in South Asia.

According to analysts, the first Quad summit held in March this year, was held to rejuvenate the grouping amid the growing influence of China in the region as the alliance was in hibernation since its inception in 2007.

Rohingya, Teesta
Responding to a question, the Chinese Ambassador said that China could not contact with the Myanmar government on the Rohingya repatriation issue as the situation in Myanmar is not normal now.

“We see no possibility of resuming the tri-patriate talks in near future,” the Ambassador said referring to the ongoing violent situation in Myanmar following the takeover of power by Myanmar military.

Responding to another question, Mr Jiming said that China will sincerely consider its engagement in Teesta River management project if the country gets feasibility study report on this project.

He added that Bangladesh government should conduct a study on the project first before sending the proposal.
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Hmmm....a warning or a request ??
 

Black_cats

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'Beijing-Dhaka ties will be substantially damaged if Bangladesh joins Quad''Beijing-Dhaka ties will be substantially damaged if Bangladesh joins Quad'



China-Bangladesh bilateral ties will be ‘substantially damaged’ if Bangladesh decides to join the US led security alliance Quadrilateral Security Dialogue (Quad) in any form, said Chinese Ambassador in Dhaka Li Jiming today (Monday).

The message was conveyed to the Bangladesh government by Chinese Defence Minister Wei Fenghe during his recent visit to Dhaka, the Ambassador said.

He was responding to a question during a virtual interaction with the members of the Diplomatic Correspondent’s Association of Bangladesh (DCAB).

Mr Jiming said China sees Quad as an alliance against the country. It is a small club of 4, and we all know what it is for China- and that is why Japan has joined hands with the US, he said.

USA, Japan, Australia and India are the members of Quad, often termed by many as the Asian NATO.

‘We do not want any form of participation of Bangladesh in this alliance,” the Chinese Ambassador made it clear.

Earlier, Chinese officials said that the defence minister during his meeting with Bangladesh President put emphasis on the need for taking joint efforts by China and Bangladesh against the formation of a military alliance led by the United States for maintaining ‘hegemony’ in South Asia.

According to analysts, the first Quad summit held in March this year, was held to rejuvenate the grouping amid the growing influence of China in the region as the alliance was in hibernation since its inception in 2007.

Rohingya, Teesta
Responding to a question, the Chinese Ambassador said that China could not contact with the Myanmar government on the Rohingya repatriation issue as the situation in Myanmar is not normal now.

“We see no possibility of resuming the tri-patriate talks in near future,” the Ambassador said referring to the ongoing violent situation in Myanmar following the takeover of power by Myanmar military.

Responding to another question, Mr Jiming said that China will sincerely consider its engagement in Teesta River management project if the country gets feasibility study report on this project.

He added that Bangladesh government should conduct a study on the project first before sending the proposal.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hmmm....a warning or a request ??
Duplicate of

 

Jobless Jack

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The bombastic tone how China will shower wrath on Bangladesh sounds very similar to what Chinese posters want to do to India and Japan.
Did i say any where I want BD to get destroyed ?

BD is a very poor country. In my opinion BD should not get involved with either Quad or China. BD needs both to develop. Angering either party will be fatal for BD. But at this moment it seems both party are in a tug of war over who BD should join. Who ever BD joins , the party who BD does not join will be very angry. Quad and China, it seems they are not interested in allowing BD to be neutral. So BD needs military teeth to at least defend herself and maintain her neutrality at all cost.

Where I said that BD should join China ? or where I said BD should join Quad? Talking about potential consequences of an action does not mean that someone is advocating for or against that action.
I am wondering why Chinese ambassador even need to say this ? Was Bangladesh planning to join quad(inside the curtain)?

Who knows! It's very hard to understand the mentality of Bangladeshi policy makers ,who's mind is like pendulum,that change side in every seconds.

I hope no policy maker will make treason and will try Bangladesh to join( or even thinking of joining ) in quad!
The problem is Awami league has very funny way of showing neutrality.

Mr Momen talks about neutrality between China and QUAD, then his colleague from the same party across the table insists BD is a close ally of India. Another colleague says BD wants to maintain close ties with China.

See the problem here ? Awami league has multiple personality disorder.

The current world politics is not multipolar. The world is being split here between China/Russia vs QUAD/NATO. If BD wants to maintain neutrality she must demonstrate that neutrality with WORDS and ACTIONS. Otherwise how would BD convince the powers that BD is actually neutral? Sooner or later they will catch BD's game, and force BD to pick a side. Which is what is happening now.

Sad reality. Awami league foreign policy has been a total disaster.
 
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Bilal9

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Saiful Islam

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Does BD even have the ammo to remain neutral?

I say don't piss China off, although the Chinese may understand our problem, they are constantly making judgement of our country all the time. Getting closer to their good books is imperative for us.

War is impractical for us and our people do not deserve it.
 

Jobless Jack

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Does BD even have the ammo to remain neutral?

I say don't piss China off, although the Chinese may understand our problem, they are constantly making judgement of our country all the time. Getting closer to their good books is imperative for us.

War is impractical for us and our people do not deserve it.
Are you crazy?

One PDF BD member is demanding china gets the checkbook ready to earn BD's allegiance and another PDF BD member is demanding that China be held accountable for not supporting BD in Rohingya issue. That BD join QUAD as retaliation for this .

When I said the highlighted points as you, I got called a fanboy and a Chinese agent.

I am just glad that I am not being deported to China yet. My future is uncertain . please pray for me
 

Saiful Islam

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Are you crazy?

One PDF BD member is demanding china gets the checkbook ready to earn BD's allegiance and another PDF BD member is demanding that China be held accountable for not supporting BD in Rohingya issue. That BD join QUAD as retaliation for this .

When I said the highlighted points as you, I got called a fanboy and a Chinese agent.

I am just glad that I am not being deported to China yet. My future is uncertain . please pray for me
My point is the following, keep a neutral stance, but do we have the ability to? Our tties with European sphere/UK/US will be in ruins, it's a lot to lose. Also when you are literally gridlocked by 'baafor bari' there isn't alot of options.

Our country is an Indian design, made so the Indians can sit down comfortably and not worry about their eastern neighbours. The Bengalis have got their own country now, but look in any direction and not too far is India. So India doesn't need to exert any kind of physical influence or invasion. It would be ideal to counterbalance with China, get some credentials ie build our economy/military. You have some boithols that is slowing it down but what can you do?

We shouldn't have had our expectations high as to the Rohingya issue, Myanmar is equally if not more important to China so why it's a shock I don't know. Cousins will always be cousins, just how we feel about the Ruiingyas.

At the end it is our fault for getting into this 'no strings attached' relationship with India. Now we are paying the price, appeasing them with parades and showering then with gifts. Giving them so much padh(gas).

Pray & hope for the best. :china:
 
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Atlas

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Mr Momen talks about neutrality between China and QUAD, then his colleague from the same party across the table insists BD is a close ally of India. Another colleague says BD wants to maintain close ties with China.
They are practicing democracy and freedom of speech by saying contradictory words. After all it's not democracy when you decide to unite and take a decision. Democracy is simply, people shall have different opinion . After all they have 260 democratic seat alone ,so you can do whatever you want. :sarcastic:

You see what's the fault of democracy system? You have the gaps of rigging the election and that's why you can do it.

Aristocracy at least have a better quality of ruling ( old days) class , because it takes generations to learn manner and achieve ruling quality.

In Bangladesh generally low lives do politics , and where the ruling class if low life , what else you expect from them,other than just sycophancy and flippancy ?
 
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Jobless Jack

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They are practicing democracy and freedom of speech by saying contradictory words. After all it's not democracy when you decide to unite and take a decision. Democracy is simply, people shall have different opinion . After all they have 260 democratic seat alone ,so you can do whatever you want. :sarcastic:

You see what's the fault of democracy system? You have the gaps of rigging the election and that's why you can do it.

Aristocracy at least have a better quality of rolling ( old days) , because it takes generations to learn manner and achieve ruling quality.

In Bangladesh generally low lives do politics , and where the ruling class if low life , what else you expect from them,other than just sycophancy and flippancy ?
I wont even talk about this anymore. Never knew that telling the outcome of an action means that advocating for/or against that action. I merely stated in my humble opinion what BD can expect if BD chooses QUAD or China as an ally, and why BD should remain neutral and upgrade her military quickly to enforce that neutrality.

But according to the PDF BD members, NOW:
1) I am a Chinese fanboy and a hardcore Chinese nationalist. ( Taiwanese?!) :woot:

2) BD is getting ready for

a) massive diplomatic showdown with Quad and China to see which husband to Choose for wedding
B) A big wallet to receive massive dowry from( China bro or Quad bro ) which ever husband she chooses( because you know, BD has so many options )
C) BD possibly punish China bro for allowing China's naughty cousin sister Burma to abuse BD's little cousin named Rohingya, so marriage might happen with Quad bro, just to get back at China bro. What we have here is a perfect romantic drama between QUAD , China and BD.
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