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Argentina Rejects American, Russian & Indian Jets Selects JF-17

Myth_buster_1

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Pakistan should not take too much pride on something that has less then 5% technical input. Instead they should work on building something thst is atleast 80% indigenous. Not dough jf is a decent fighter but still......
 

Beast

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This is infact correct, If UK wasn’t an issue, America would have pressured Argentina into buying F-16s long ago, but US cannot put much pressure as that would be a direct slap on the face of their closest Ally, selling fighter jets to their enemy. Thats why I believe this deal may still go through. But I’ll wait until deliveries, I still doubt Argentinian economic situation.
The F-16 deal will never happened. Trust me. Unless US regards Argentina a more important ally than UK.
 

Ghessan

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as China was negotiating the deal with Argentinians and the news by other sources is protray as Argentina buying Chinese planes, why ukdefencejournal is breaking news as buying jets from Pakistan, is it deliberate? to give it a hype in UK and against Pakistan?

today when i see this project as a joint venture, it make me realize could Pakistan sell the jets if it was solely their plane (although we own it yes) or the production line was totally shifted to Pakistan?

this JV is providing us a lot of opportunities to go into fighter jet market sale. although it is PAF who inducted over 100 planes solely which gives a credibility to it.

there is a long way before and after the deal is signed and tons of hurdles, vulnerable is Argentina.
 

TheDarkKnight

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Waiting for Indians to say:
1) HAL is going with a delegation to present LCA tejas and the deal is now on hold
2) Tejas had a US origin engine so UK lobbied to not let Tejas compete in the tender - other wise had Tejas competed there was no chance for Jf17.
3) What has Pakistan to do with this aircraft, its a Chinese aircraft - so congrats to China. The celebrations of Pakistanis make no sense to us.
4) Argentine Air force participated in bombing of Panjshir resistance in jf17s.

Am I missing any?
 

iLION12345_1

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Waiting for Indians to say:
1) HAL is going with a delegation to present LCA tejas and the deal is now on hold
2) Tejas had a US origin engine so UK lobbied to not let Tejas compete in the tender - other wise had Tejas competed there was no chance for Jf17.
3) What has Pakistan to do with this aircraft, its a Chinese aircraft - so congrats to China. The celebrations of Pakistanis make no sense to us.
4) Argentine Air force participated in bombing of Panjshir resistance in jf17s.

Am I missing any?
You forgot the the one where Indian MiG-21s Shoot down these JF-17s on their delivery flight without firing any missiles.
 

TheDarkKnight

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You forgot the the one where Indian MiG-21s Shoot down these JF-17s on their delivery flight without firing any missiles.
That was F16 blk 52 with late wing cmdr Shahzadudin shaheed - lynched brutally by our own Kashmiris despite him wearing a PAF uniform that has a shoulder badge with Pakistani flag.
 

Chacha_Facebooka

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as China was negotiating the deal with Argentinians and the news by other sources is protray as Argentina buying Chinese planes, why ukdefencejournal is breaking news as buying jets from Pakistan, is it deliberate? to give it a hype in UK and against Pakistan?
Jeff was designed specifically for PAF. China doesn't use it. It is built jointly by China and Pakistan. I doesn't matter who "negotiated" as it will be partly be built in Pak.
 

redtom

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Argentina has $270 billion in foreign debt and the country is close to bankruptcy. Trust me, the Argentine government doesn't have the money to buy these planes.

However, China and Argentina have currency swap agreements. In theory Argentina doesn't have to pay; it can use goods to cover the debt. Argentina's beef export price is about $6 per kilogram, and Argentina only needs to provide 100,000 tons of beef. That's easy for Argentina.

China and Argentina have perfect economic complementarity as long as Argentina can stabilize its domestic politics and keep the US out of the way. Economic problems are easy to solve.
 

TheDarkKnight

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Argentina has $270 billion in foreign debt and the country is close to bankruptcy. Trust me, the Argentine government doesn't have the money to buy these planes.

However, China and Argentina have currency swap agreements. In theory Argentina doesn't have to pay; it can use goods to cover the debt. Argentina's beef export price is about $6 per kilogram, and Argentina only needs to provide 100,000 tons of beef. That's easy for Argentina.

China and Argentina have perfect economic complementarity as long as Argentina can stabilize its domestic politics and keep the US out of the way. Economic problems are easy to solve.
Argentina is way ahead of Pakistan in every aspect of economy : GDP, industrial base, very high HDI and literacy rate. Their GDP is 400 bln plus with GDP per captia of 22k$, which is more than 10x of Pakistan GDP per captia. It is the the second largest economy in SA. Their main problem has been debt management and are currently going through a default program.
 

Ghessan

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Jeff was designed specifically for PAF. China doesn't use it. It is built jointly by China and Pakistan. I doesn't matter who "negotiated" as it will be partly be built in Pak.
ohh, i never knew this, thanks.
sorry but i was having a phd when it happen.
 

Marker

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Argentina allocates 664M for JF-17 Block III purchase in FY2022


PorGASTÓN DUBOIS
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16/09/2021
View attachment 778401


Yesterday, the draft budget for fiscal year 2022 was presented to the National Congress, which includes a request of US$ 664 million for the acquisition of JF-17 Thunder Block III fighters.

Thus, it is now clear which is the choice of the Argentine Air Force (FAA) for its next supersonic fighter, discarding the offers from Russia, USA and India.


JF-17 Block III presupuesto 2022

The budget requested would be enough for the purchase of 12 JF-17 Thunder in its latest and most modern standard, taking into account the rumored price of 50 million per unit (which the Government would have tried to lower). Also, within this U$S 664 million, 20 million are contemplated for the repair and modernization of the runways and infrastructure that would host the new aircrafts.

So far, this is the clearest sign in favor of the Chinese option, which evidences the Air Force’s firm intention to complete the purchase as soon as possible. However, no one can claim victory yet. Until the contract is signed and the first funds are disbursed, there may still be counter-offers from other countries.

JF-17 Block III
First prototype of the JF-17 Thunder Block III, the one that the Argentine Air Force desires.

And it should also be remembered that in 2015, during Agustín Rossi’s first term as Argentina’s Minister of Defense, a budget of U$D 360 million had been authorized for the purchase of 14 IAI Kfir, which was then frozen in view of the imminent change of government. And finally, the administration of President Mauricio Macri decided to dismiss the acquisition of the Israeli fighters.

Therefore, the presence of the Thunder in the 2022 budget should be taken only as a purchase intention (a serious and firm indication, that’s for sure), and not as a deal already closed. One cannot underestimate the current economic and political situation in the country, in which the incorporation of modern weapon systems may not be seen as a priority.

If this deal is officially closed, meaning the budget approved by Argentina's National Congress, and funds allocated for 12 JF-17, it will signify that Chinese and Pakistani Military Aviation Industry market has reached the South American soil.

Currently Argentine Air Force is having 6 Pampa 3 (AJT/ combat aircraft) and 23 A-4AR Skyhawk (light attack aircraft). induction of !2 JF-17s in AAF inventory, will open South American market for Chinese brand of aviation products, including aircraft and its lethal weaponry.

IMO, after initial induction, possibility of AAF opting to acquire additional 36 to 38 JF-17A and B Blk 3 aircraft cannot be ruled out.
 

Marker

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Even if officially confirmed, we should wait till the contract is signed and at least one plane is delivered. Look at how Australia pulled out of the deal with France. At least it will only be, presumably, a few years before the first JF-17 Block 3 could land in Argentina.

but overall a positive development for PAC, getting another customer. Hopefully this converts to Malaysia also picking the JF-17
Australia is altogether a different case. They were offered better option than what France was offering. Both UK and US are involved in this deal. Nuclear submarines with US technology build in Australian facilities is a very lucrative deal.

Argentina, after Falklands war was never in good terms with UK, hence provision of Western weapon systems is a remote possibility, unless US intervenes which is also highly unlikely as both UK and US are buddy buddy but you never know, keeping in mind how US change their allies over their "National Interest".
 

Marker

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I agree, I feel like they’ve definitely picked the aircraft over the others, but there is a danger of them cancelling the order or their government not approving it. They really don’t have the money.

However since China is the one handling this deal, we may see some sort of funding or loans provided, as China usually does. For them it’s more than just about selling the aircraft, it’s about influence in the region, they will try not to miss the chance.
Possibility of Chinese asking for a military base and port in return of this deal and some other financial benefits cannot be ruled out.
 

iLION12345_1

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If this deal is officially closed, meaning the budget approved by Argentina's National Congress, and funds allocated for 12 JF-17, it will signify that Chinese and Pakistani Military Aviation Industry market has reached the South American soil.

Currently Argentine Air Force is having 6 Pampa 3 (AJT/ combat aircraft) and 23 A-4AR Skyhawk (light attack aircraft). induction of !2 JF-17s in AAF inventory, will open South American market for Chinese brand of aviation products, including aircraft and its lethal weaponry.

IMO, after initial induction, possibility of AAF opting to acquire additional 36 to 38 JF-17A and B Blk 3 aircraft cannot be ruled out.
They have very few Skyhawks operational, Maybe even less than 10.
 

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