• Saturday, October 19, 2019

Ancient Arab female rulers and the only de-facto female Caliph in history - Do Arabs hate women?

Discussion in 'Arab Defence Forum' started by Saif al-Arab, Jun 22, 2018.

  1. Pan-Islamic-Pakistan

    Pan-Islamic-Pakistan SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    6,191
    Joined:
    May 28, 2018
    Ratings:
    +4 / 11,334 / -1
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    United States
    Great post. Thanks for sharing.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  2. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

    Messages:
    8,873
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2015
    Ratings:
    +13 / 10,400 / -8
    Country:
    Saudi Arabia
    Location:
    Spain
    Guess, what, who funded the oldest current-existing university in the world? Yes, you guessed it right, an Arab woman.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Al_Quaraouiyine

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatima_al-Fihri

    Fatima bint Muhammad Al-Fihriya Al-Qurashiya (Arabic: فاطمة بنت محمد الفهرية القرشية‎) was an Arab Muslim woman who is credited for founding the oldest existing, continually operating and first degree-awarding educational institution in the world, The University of Al Quaraouiyine in Fes, Morocco in 859 CE.[1]


    Al-Qurashiya (Qureyshi) = Hijazi. She was born in year 800, so definitely a genuine Qureyshi and part of the relatively newly arrived elite in the Maghreb.

    Next time you meet some ignorant buffoon online that tries to tell you that Arabs have always oppressed their women, kindly link him or her to this thread. Thanks in advance.

    Which is the central problem here, Hannibal. Today people do not bother to spend some time to find the "truth". Stereotypes rule supreme. You read some nonsense written in a tabloid in the UK about something absurd in KSA or any other Arab or Muslim country (often not truth at all, highly exaggerated in order to get extra clicks, you know how tabloid journalism works like) and you have already made your mind up.

    This thread is not about realities of today (which we can measure clearly and they are not favorable for the Arab world, but surely not the wider Muslim world either, and that has to be said although things are improving but it is not as bad as in many regions of the world which we should also remember) but history.

    It's basically a rebuff of some of the propaganda that I have encountered as an Arab online. Before I dwelled into this part of our history, I knew close to nothing because we hardly learned anything about this topic. So like many Arabs and with many topics, I simply did my own research. Now I can pick nonsense apart easily. Is that not what knowledge is about? Gaining a greater understanding. Trying to find the "truth". I get it, history is not a natural science but not too far from it either.

    Anyway a brother is free to make a thread about the conditions of women in the Arab world but this is probably not the forum for this as I will let actual Arab women speak for themselves and I will not speak in their name. The only Arab female user that I am aware of here on PDF was a very friendly Omani lady that lived in Japan of all countries.

    @SALMAN F can't remember her username. You are the best at remembering such things. Help me out here.:D

    Never mind. Remembered her. @Chai was her username. Last active 4 April 2015.

    She was from Dhofar and this region is very close to Yemen and she was clearly upset about the Yemen conflict (her last comment) and I don't blame her.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
    • Thanks Thanks x 4
  3. HannibalBarca

    HannibalBarca SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    7,039
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2017
    Ratings:
    +3 / 7,097 / -0
    Country:
    Tunisia
    Location:
    France
    That's where people get confused... Those who swear by facts and Truth wouldn't be near or in those "groups" of Denials...
    Therefore what is left is indeed made of people, who lack proper "Education" and "Logical Thinking"... Who doesn't care about Truth... They need to be part of a group...

    If you speak with them directly and try to understand their background/Experience...you will most of time find that they have no Prior Hate toward that particular "Group/Thinking" in their Life...

    But, They are people who need to be relevant...seen...admired...Loved etc... Therefore will join a "Group"... If you know who many people I came across who are the embodiment of Paradox... you will be surprised... I happen to come across someone who hate "Jews" and Love "BiBi" and their "bar mitzvah party"... or Hate Muslims and yet having a Muslim bestFriend and 80% of his close friends who are Muslims...

    By having a place...They hope to keep existing in our society... In a sense... it's not entirely their fault... But they are indeed responsible towards the consequences of their actions...
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 3
  4. SALMAN F

    SALMAN F BANNED

    Messages:
    4,368
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Ratings:
    +1 / 5,196 / -25
    Country:
    Iraq
    Location:
    Lebanon
    She is from the same clan and tribe if the arab military commander who conquered North Africa
    The his also the founder of the Qirwan city
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uqba_ibn_Nafi

    He was also the nightmare of the stateless ceylal :lol:
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  5. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

    Messages:
    8,873
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2015
    Ratings:
    +13 / 10,400 / -8
    Country:
    Saudi Arabia
    Location:
    Spain
    Bro, I must once again make clear that I consider Berbers (although there are no "pure Berbers" or "pure Arabs") as brothers especially as most people (if not everyone) in the Maghreb are Arab-Berber mixtures (added with other more minor elements) similar to how us in the Mashriq are mixtures of Arabs and various ancient Semitic peoples (closely related to Arabs, just like Arabs and Berbers are related - same linguistic family too) and some mentally deranged individual like Ceylal who clearly suffers from schizophrenia (one day he is writing that he cannot hate Arabs as we share blood and culture) and the other day he is insulting Arabs from Morocco to Yemen, should not give rise to targeting groups of people in the Arab world.

    I know that he is easy to "bully" online due to his character, megalomaniac behavior, delusion, constant insults and the amount of nonsense that he writes and posts in general, but as @HannibalBarca wrote yesterday, we should only target him and not follow his example when he insults entire countries when he for instances discusses with Arab users here.

    The most funny thing, I had a discussion online with a Kabyle girl from Algeria who lived in Kuwait (younger than me so pretty young) the other day and she was lightyears away rom Ceylal. Most Kabyle (some 5 million worldwide) are like that.

    So best is not to take him too seriously but I know from experience that it is hard at times.:lol:
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  6. SALMAN F

    SALMAN F BANNED

    Messages:
    4,368
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Ratings:
    +1 / 5,196 / -25
    Country:
    Iraq
    Location:
    Lebanon
    That's why I didn't say Berbers I only said the stateless ceylal the obsessed who always brag about how the algerian army saved Egypt :lol:
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  7. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

    Messages:
    8,873
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2015
    Ratings:
    +13 / 10,400 / -8
    Country:
    Saudi Arabia
    Location:
    Spain
    Well said. I know exactly what you are talking about. I had non-Arab friends who used to sing praises about Arabs when it suited them and when it did not suit them (for instance among anti-Muslims in lack of a better word) acted like the clown in the class (silently listening to bullshit without countering it). A lot was said in a joking manner so I have not really experienced the "real thing" but the "grouping thing" that you talk about, I am afraid that it is human nature and always was part of us and will be.

    However you can come a long way with knowledge and "facts" and those people, institutions etc. in the world that matter, this is their lingua franca.

    So let us leave the internet trolling to the internet and the real world for the real world.

    You could make an entire comedy sitcom based on "Celyal's greatest moments" or "Ceylal's greatest hits".



    The funniest thing, the guy is almost approaching 40 years as per his own words.:lol::enjoy::rofl: I like the Algeria STRONK mentality. Typical of the Arab world and region. We also have KSA STRONK guys online haha. Funniest people online. Some of the best ones (most deluded) are our Turkish neighbors and friends. It's a classic among Western people to encounter it online.:D In Denmark (where there are almost as many Turks as Arabs if not more) there were some jokes related to this. Whenever Turkey played in a EURO, some of those Turkey STRONK guys, always made bombastic claims online.:lol:

    BTW in Spain it is mostly the Moroccans who are Morocco STRONK.:lol: But sadly not very active after Morocco losing the 2 first games and now being out of the World Cup. I can't imagine if they still had a chance. They are playing Spain next. Rivalry and all. Ceuta, Melilla etc.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
    • Thanks Thanks x 2
  8. SALMAN F

    SALMAN F BANNED

    Messages:
    4,368
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Ratings:
    +1 / 5,196 / -25
    Country:
    Iraq
    Location:
    Lebanon
    Specially with the part that he defeated sharon in Suez Canal and also the iraqis should marry with Kurds so they can have a super warrior genes:lol::rofl:
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  9. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

    Messages:
    8,873
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2015
    Ratings:
    +13 / 10,400 / -8
    Country:
    Saudi Arabia
    Location:
    Spain
    That's the funniest thing ever. Nothing against Kurds but a people whose sovereign nations can be counted on 1-3 fingers (at most) and whose most famous representative was an Arabized Kurd, the great Saladdin (ra) whose military was majority Arab and Turkish, that "warrior gene" comment was hilarious. Still remember it. @TheCamelGuy under his old usernames, made fantastic comments about this.:lol.

    1 year later and this happens;



    Notice the language (sound).





    What made them cry like babies;



    2 million views!

     
    • Thanks Thanks x 2
  10. Gomig-21

    Gomig-21 SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    3,263
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2016
    Ratings:
    +10 / 6,289 / -0
    Country:
    Egypt
    Location:
    United States
    I think it's not necessarily that they abhor their own women, and we are talking about a very low number of people because to me, it seems the overwhelming majority tend to be particularly obsessive about their women, especially family related ones. But there are the nitwits out there, I suppose just like any other race of people that have that certain outlook towards women in general.

    Yeah she's pretty well know since the revolution, she's turned into quite the feminist/activist. I agree about Mehdi, quite annoying, actually.
    I did see that clip before and while I agree with a lot of what she says (and she's been through a lot, actually) but I've always questioned where she got those numbers/stats in her opening line. I'm not sure about the Yemeni women, but 91% of Egyptian girls experience genital mutilation? I think she criss-crossed her information, there.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 2
  11. MBT 3000

    MBT 3000 SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    3,402
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2017
    Ratings:
    +0 / 1,668 / -1
    Country:
    Norway
    Location:
    Norway
    dont think all of those women were fully arab or that. lol but zenobia, whats important about her? she destroyed her dead husbands work and betrayed rome, good that aurelian deafeated palmyra during the crisis of the third century. but she did hold back the sassanids though.

    btw im an history enthsuasist and know a lot or some about romans,ottomans etc
     
  12. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

    Messages:
    8,873
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2015
    Ratings:
    +13 / 10,400 / -8
    Country:
    Saudi Arabia
    Location:
    Spain
    Did you actually bother to read the informative and factual thread post before replying in this thread? Seems not to be the case.

    No, they were all Arab.

    The purpose was to showcase that Arabs in pre-Islamic times had more female rulers than practically everyone else and that some of those ancient Arab female rulers are some of the most ancient and famous female rulers in history. Other than that additional historical evidence was used to disprove nonsense and propaganda (falsehood) that your likes spread on this topic.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. MBT 3000

    MBT 3000 SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    3,402
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2017
    Ratings:
    +0 / 1,668 / -1
    Country:
    Norway
    Location:
    Norway
    didnt read all, but did you read my comment on zenobia? and what are your views on her?
     
  14. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

    Messages:
    8,873
    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2015
    Ratings:
    +13 / 10,400 / -8
    Country:
    Saudi Arabia
    Location:
    Spain
    Then I would invite you to do so before commenting.

    One of the greatest female rulers in antiquity.

    [​IMG]

    Palmyra at its zenith in 271

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zenobia



     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  15. MBT 3000

    MBT 3000 SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    3,402
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2017
    Ratings:
    +0 / 1,668 / -1
    Country:
    Norway
    Location:
    Norway
    also her husband Odaenatheus is called hero of the east for defending romes eastern borders against the Sassanids and crushing their invasion. she decleared her son emperor and made her regent of palmyra and by that she betrayed rome during the crisis of the third century and betrayed her dead husband and his legacy . she then takes egypt causing grain crisis in rome but later she would be defeated by emperor Aurelian who would fight the gallic empire later.

    one thing i dont understand what was great about her?
    her empire didnt exist very long and would be reconquered by Rome