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Path-Finder

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for those '#$%&*' who think this whole war was not against Pakistan, the war of terror. one only has to see the map.

1626645577034.png


they tried playing their game, the lar o bar. the need to take Balochistan away From Pakistan. but even this map was not reflecting their true desires. Syria has been decimated. Iraq fragmented. The attempt to make Kurdistan was thwarted by Turkey.

so this proxy game where the yanks were the terrorist umbrella in the hands of india. india under their protection used afghani land against Pakistan. we can call it as quarterbacking terrorism too.

Pakistan suffered greatly but it didnt kill us but it will make us stronger InshAllah.
 

CrazyZ

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What Pakistan achieved blindly following uncle sam
70K + dead
Billions in damages
Over decade of internal fighting
Trusted a so called ally who blames and destroys its friends and enemies alike.
For uncle sam Pakistan or Pakistani people dont exist nothing more then pawns in global game.
Just like past Uncle Sam is leaving whole area destroyed and more divided then every, neighbours hating each other.

Simple story is this Pakistan is the perfect scape goat thanks to strength of media and pakistani state politicians and military alike are to busy filling its own pockets.

Its funny how no one mentions uncle Sam supporting these so called groups for its own benefit for years indirectly sponsoring and have the audacity to blame others
Pakistan didn't have much of a choice. Only difference in the global chess game this time is that the USA hurt its own position as well. Those trillions wasted in the ME and Afghanistan could have been invested in industry, technology and infrastructure inside the USA......reinforcing it against a rising China.

The Obama administration ignored requests to replenish the medical supplies in the national stock pile, putting the USA in a very bad position at the start of this pandemic......but spent lavishly on wars. Very Ironic for a President whos signature accomplishment is Obamacare.

The USA has been following a USSR approach dedicating large portions of its GDP to defense....when all that was required was a handful of forces needed to wipe out AQ with Pakistan's help. USA strategists can only blame themselves.
 

waz

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The Americans like their Indian and Northern Alliance counterparts are butthurt. Twenty years of proxy war against Pakistan has failed. The author acknowledges this.
Yep and whose fault is that? Their own. This situation would never have happened. By throwing Pakistan to the wind, crippling it with sanctions, there was no way it could have done anything to calm the fallout in Afghanistan so it hedged its bets on a religious milita with strong ties to our own Pashtun community.
Let's go back in time and set the scene that after the Soviets left the US turned a blind eye to Pakistan's development of the bomb. It did after all give the benefit of doubt to India in 1974. After this they introduced a comprehensive economic and military development package to help rebuild Pakistan after years of its ally bearing the full brunt of the war.
Would there have been the need for the Taliban? Would Al-Qaeda have settled in the region? No to both. Economically, politically and militarily strong Pakistan would have had the US's back in the region. But oh no their wise foreign policy advisors saw Pakistan at best to be ignored or at worst a fanatical country with a bomb. Their ilk also advised Biden to ask Central Asian states for bases after Biden called Putin a cold killer, you literally can't make such idiotic incompetency up. Now they find themselves being cut out of the region.
After Reagan it started to fall, and now has come crashing down.
 
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Hakikat ve Hikmet

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for those '#$%&*' who think this whole war was not against Pakistan, the war of terror. one only has to see the map.

their protection used afghani land against Pakistan. we can call it as quarterbacking terrorism too.

Pakistan suffered greatly but it didnt kill us but it will make us stronger InshAllah.
Amin Summe Amin....
 

LeGenD

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for those '#$%&*' who think this whole war was not against Pakistan, the war of terror. one only has to see the map.

View attachment 763438

they tried playing their game, the lar o bar. the need to take Balochistan away From Pakistan. but even this map was not reflecting their true desires. Syria has been decimated. Iraq fragmented. The attempt to make Kurdistan was thwarted by Turkey.

so this proxy game where the yanks were the terrorist umbrella in the hands of india. india under their protection used afghani land against Pakistan. we can call it as quarterbacking terrorism too.

Pakistan suffered greatly but it didnt kill us but it will make us stronger InshAllah.
This map is from Ralph Peters who visualized those boundaries on the basis of 'natural ties of blood and faith' as per him. His argument was that the entire region would be more stable and peaceful with such boundaries than those in reality.


It isn't something USA would strive for in official capacity. Just look at the size of Israel in the revisited map (back to pre-1967 borders); USA have shifted its embassy to Jerusalem however.

The best time to split Iraq was in 2006 when Kurd, Sunni and Shia were at each other's throats but USA did not let it happen either.

Assuming that the USA benefits from inter-state rivalries, original map (statusquo) is better fit in its calculus.

India would want to split Pakistan however. And India have had access to Afghanistan via Iran.
 

Nasr

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How America turned the "good war" into a "dumb war."

When President Joe Biden declared the withdrawal of U.S. troops from Afghanistan after twenty years of fighting, he declared that the original objectives for the invasion had been achieved. “We were attacked, we went to war with clear goals,” he gravely intoned. “We achieved those objectives. Bin Laden is dead and Al Qaeda is degraded in Afghanistan, and it’s time to end this forever war.” Curiously, he omitted where exactly the founder of Al Qaeda had met his end.

The reaction was as swift as it was predictable. The New York Times, framing the debate along familiar terms, asked, “Will Afghanistan become a Terrorism Safe Haven Once Again?” The ranking member of the U.S. Senate Committee on Armed Services, Senator Jim Inhofe of Oklahoma, warned Afghanistan would “become a safe haven for terrorists once again.” That there already exists “safe haven” for terrorists in and near the country was not mentioned.

Shortly after Biden’s announcement, Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin reportedly expressed “appreciation for Pakistan’s support” during peace negotiations in Afghanistan with the Taliban. It is not clear whether Secretary Austin had in mind the full breadth of Pakistan’s activities in Afghanistan when referring to its “support” for these ongoing and inconclusive diplomatic talks.

Carl von Clausewitz declared that “the first, the supreme, the most far-reaching act of judgment that the statesman and commander have to make is to establish…the kind of war on which they are embarking; neither mistaking it for, not trying to turn it into, something that is alien to its nature.” This most fundamental task of accurate conceptualization has also been the most overlooked and underrated in the formulation and implementation of U.S. military strategy.

As complex and confusing as the situation in Afghanistan is for foreign observers and visitors, the most fundamental lacuna in the analysis and strategy behind U.S. objectives in the country is a manifest failure to clearly acknowledge and accept the situation on the ground in Afghanistan for what it is: the United States has been waging and losing a proxy war against an alleged ally.

The mission to transform a barren, mountainous, landlocked, and impoverished country in one of the most remote parts of the Eurasian landmass—after decades of armed conflict and revolutionary upheaval—into a stable democracy with no safe havens for terrorism is tragic and difficult enough. It becomes indefensibly absurd when also claiming to do so in partnership with a country that bears the most responsibility for the continuing chaos and carnage in Afghanistan.

Axis or Ally?

Among all the moral compromises made by Washington in its diplomatic relationships during the War on Terror, the U.S. relationship with Islamabad might be the most destructive and counterproductive. Less than five months after the shock of the 9/11 attacks, President George W. Bush announced the existence of an “Axis of Evil” that represented the greatest threat to world peace. Notably, none of the countries identified had any role in the attacks, nor had any of their citizens. What was stranger yet about the composition of this “axis” was that these countries, as hostile as their regimes were to U.S. interests, did not include the world’s worst offender. When examining what went wrong in the U.S. war against the Taliban in Afghanistan, it bears reviewing the central role Pakistan has played in sabotaging any prospects of victory.

It has long been an open secret that Pakistan has actively and consistently thwarted U.S. operations against the Taliban and Al Qaeda since the attacks of September 11, 2001. For as long as the U.S. has been in Afghanistan, however, the polite fiction of Pakistan as a reliable ally has persisted despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. As a state sponsor of terrorism, Pakistan has matched or exceeded the actions and patterns of sanctioned regimes in Iran and North Korea. The flagrant involvement of its so-called “deep state” in the finances and operations of known terrorist groups as a matter of course has also been far more direct and intimate than any of the suspected links attributed to the Gulf Arab states or their citizens. Yet in stark contrast to intense U.S. pressure on its Arab allies to crack down on terrorism, or U.S. sanctions on Iran and North Korea, Pakistan’s rulers have enjoyed relative impunity since 2001.

After the United States invaded Afghanistan, Pakistan gave shelter to elements of both Al Qaeda and the Taliban. Osama Bin Laden himself would take up residence in an elite suburb in close proximity to Pakistan’s military academy in Abbottabad. After Bin Laden was finally found and killed, Pakistani authorities retaliated against local informants cooperating with U.S. intelligence. In spite of the evidence, there would be no major changes to the U.S. relationship with Pakistan.

The designation of Pakistan as a “major non-NATO ally” under President Bush was followed by the next administration proclaiming that an “effective partnership with Pakistan” would be a core element of the U.S. war against the Taliban. Pakistan’s ostensible efforts to confront its own proxies would be supported by generous aid from the United States. As the Pentagon pressured the White House to escalate the war, increasing numbers of U.S. troops and civilian officials were being sent into harm’s way and tasked with implementing near impossible projects of social transformation. At the same time, the United States sent aid to the country that directed efforts to arm and train the Taliban insurgency. The absurd implications of U.S. policy and strategy are such that it would be as if America had waged the Vietnam War while also sending aid to Hanoi.

A sole superpower of the world, more so a "Ruling State" and the america had everything at its disposal. Be it money (endless), be it military (most powerful), be it allies (nato) or anything else. Yet a "third world" state, with little to limited resources, as the most divided internally ever, facing enemies on all fronts and an active plot to dismember it and denuclearize it.

Yeah, it was a victory alright. But no one ever bothers to think that without Allah Subhanahu Wata'aalah, Pakistan would have long disappeared into the annals of history, forgotten.

Maybe one day, the people of Pakistan would realize why they exist and WHOM they owe their existence to.

Maybe .... just maybe!
 

Path-Finder

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This map is from Ralph Peters who visualized those boundaries on the basis of 'natural ties of blood and faith' as per him. His argument was that the entire region would be more stable and peaceful with such boundaries than those in reality.


It isn't something USA would strive for in official capacity. Just look at the size of Israel in the revisited map (back to pre-1967 borders); USA have shifted its embassy to Jerusalem however.

The best time to split Iraq was in 2006 when Kurd, Sunni and Shia were at each other's throats but USA did not let it happen either.

Assuming that the USA benefits from inter-state rivalries, original map (statusquo) is better fit in its calculus.

India would want to split Pakistan however. And India have had access to Afghanistan via Iran.
let me put it very simply. one can shun it away as it were nonchalant, a mere doodle. But the ground realities shows us something completely different. CIA said that by 2015 Pakistan will be failed state. now to fail a state like Pakistan; one has to stir many hornets nest.

  1. hit the economy, check
  2. destabilise the country with the most vile and vicious militant terrorism, check
  3. install corrupt people on the top, check
  4. stir ethno fascism in areas highlighted in the map, check

a tip of the iceberg but on the backdrop of these few points its not difficult to see the map wasnt just a pot shot.
 

V. Makarov

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The article is another example of US whining by conservative and traditional scholars who study International Relations. There are quite a few of them actually, who are now popping out like frogs after rain; constantly crying and blaming others for a lost war.

I won't even start discussing what Pakistan went through by supporting US against this clown war, as it would take up extra space of PDF servers. Instead, I would just roast the US policymakers/think tanks, on their steaming pile of sh*t policies, that failed so miserably that it's funny. Taliban are now at the gates of Kabul, with 90% of the territory in their hands, Afghanistan is still home to Al-Qaeda and ISIS. What objectives did Washington achieve? Are we so dumb to understand their motives? Are they 5 parallel universes ahead from us? Don't think so.

I think even if Pakistan is responsible for each one of US failures in Afghanistan (like the gentleman argues in the original article), then this does not absolve USA from the failures and mess that they have created in Afghanistan. The only losers are the people in this region. That's it.
 

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What could not be achieved by subversion against Pakistan by the US is being achieved by making it a failed state on the economic front. The reality of the situation is that the country cannot sustain an extravagant lifestyle. The economic collapse is near. Then we would be forced to abandon the Islamic Bomb. The present government has been taking very high loans. God knows where all that money is going. We need to tighten our belts and start austerity measures if we want to survive for the long term. We need to give up high life style and adopt a saving and education culture instead of a Brands culture.
 

imadul

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It is a neocon publishing site. Their's and this mindsets destructive achievements are there for everyone to see in Iraq and Afghanistan. Destroying fabric of society, culture, and infra in Iraq gave birth to the curse of ISIS in the region. Job achieved 3/4th, but somehow Pakistan survived TTP and India's total utmost efforts to break Pakistan. We are witnessing 1/4 of it as failure in Afg.
 

VCheng

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let me put it very simply. one can shun it away as it were nonchalant, a mere doodle. But the ground realities shows us something completely different. CIA said that by 2015 Pakistan will be failed state. now to fail a state like Pakistan; one has to stir many hornets nest.

  1. hit the economy, check
  2. destabilise the country with the most vile and vicious militant terrorism, check
  3. install corrupt people on the top, check
  4. stir ethno fascism in areas highlighted in the map, check

a tip of the iceberg but on the backdrop of these few points its not difficult to see the map wasnt just a pot shot.
So let's see:

  1. hit the economy, check > Has the economy recovered?
  2. destabilise the country with the most vile and vicious militant terrorism, check > Has militant terrorism been defeated?
  3. install corrupt people on the top, check > Have corrupt people been removed and/or punished in any effective manner?
  4. stir ethno fascism in areas highlighted in the map, check > Have the ethnic issues been resolved, specially in Karachi and Baluchistan?
Let's arm the door slides and cross-check before take-off.
History of backstabbing from the US.
USA does not need, nor has asked for, any bases in Pakistan.
 

fitpOsitive

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for those '#$%&*' who think this whole war was not against Pakistan, the war of terror. one only has to see the map.

View attachment 763438

they tried playing their game, the lar o bar. the need to take Balochistan away From Pakistan. but even this map was not reflecting their true desires. Syria has been decimated. Iraq fragmented. The attempt to make Kurdistan was thwarted by Turkey.

so this proxy game where the yanks were the terrorist umbrella in the hands of india. india under their protection used afghani land against Pakistan. we can call it as quarterbacking terrorism too.

Pakistan suffered greatly but it didnt kill us but it will make us stronger InshAllah.
USA came with some motives. Which Pakistan didn't understand fully. Pakistan responded according our own understanding. We concentrated on USA too much, which was not the main force which wad attacking Pakistan.
The cause of war was, however, not understood by any country. The whole purpose of this war to open the areas where modern means couldn't reach earlier. USA left a lot of stuff behind. USA even accepted and negotiated with talibs.

This war was a part of global efforts which wanted to uproot those people which could be cause of revolution in Islamic world. Just look at the list of ulamas murdered in Pakistan and globally during this war on terror, and by who? Don't know. But very targeted.
Islam as a way of life was and is a target. Islam as a reliogion was never a target, will never be a target. But when you try to see things from national prism, you totally miss the main draft of this war story.
 

VCheng

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Islam as a way of life was and is a target. Islam as a reliogion was never a target, will never be a target.
Islam is the fastest growing religion in the the world, and no one has any problems with either Islam as a religion, or Islam as a way of life for its followers.

It is only when one group takes it upon themselves to impose their own version of the religion on everybody around them by force when the issues and conflicts arise.

If the people of Afghanistan, and/or the people of Pakistan want to impose their own sets of religious laws within their own borders by social consensus, nobody across the globe would have any problem with it.
 

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