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ALL Xinjiang related issues e.g. uyghur people, development, videos etc, In here please.

An Independent East Turkestan will be bad for Pakistan

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Cheehg

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so what are all those buildings built between 2019-2021 in Xinjging with blue roofs? toy factories ?

why did China not give access to Human right commissioner after 27 requests ?

Genocide is now recognised by the international community and it will be referred to as such, a Genocide and ethnic cleansing

China has also taken Han Chinese families and told them to adopt the Ughurs and force them into converting to Han Chinese

China also did this in Tibet and HK
You are saying they cannot build anything in Xinjiang?
 

Reashot Xigwin

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It’s sad that you go with the MSM smear. Of course the whole establishment media regard Grayzone as propaganda. As they won’t toe the establishment narrative. The same Russiagate or Saddam’s WDM narrative. I can guarantee that any one deny WDM in 2003 would be smeared and treated as an enemy. Just like how the establishment is treating Grayzone.

never again I would be deceived like in 2003.
Instead you get deceived by russian propaganda outlet. How is that an improvement?

Also russiagate is real. Robert Mueller even testify under oath & named DJT as prime suspect. Trump Tower meeting - Wikipedia

This is why gullible people like you who immediately believes Russian & chinese propaganda are even worse than Trump supporters.

So far even non mainstream outlet confirm that situation in Xinjiang can be classified as genocide.
 

faithfulguy

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Instead you get deceived by russian propaganda outlet. How is that an improvement?

Also russiagate is real. Robert Mueller even testify under oath & named DJT as prime suspect. Trump Tower meeting - Wikipedia

This is why gullible people like you who immediately believes Russian & chinese propaganda are even worse than Trump supporters.

So far even non mainstream outlet confirm that situation in Xinjiang can be classified as genocide.
If you still think Russiagate is real, than you must be still looking for Iraqi WDM. The MSM really get you good.
 

Reashot Xigwin

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If you still think Russiagate is real, than you must be still looking for Iraqi WDM. The MSM really get you good.
There's around 30 people convicted with over 100 criminal charges filed against them. It's real alright.

Let me guess you prob listen to jimmy dore if you read Grayzone. Did you know he's a sexual predator? Just pointing out the kind of people you support.
 

faithfulguy

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There's around 30 people convicted with over 100 criminal charges filed against them. It's real alright.

Let me guess you prob listen to jimmy dore if you read Grayzone. Did you know he's a sexual predator? Just pointing out the kind of people you support.
Ana, is that you. Ana???
TYT stooge like you support them because you are exposed as MSM shill.And you like being shills. Why even exist if you sound like Rachel Maddow. Did you see the Roger Waters interview in Katie Helper show. That was golden, isn’t it. He tore you up, Ana.
 

master_13

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mr ostrich, there are witness accounts collected by Amnesty International now.
and like the suspicions about possible WMDs in Iraq was Saddam's responsibility to *disprove*, and like Iran and North-Korea have the responsibility to prove their ongoing innocence when it comes to nuclear weapons development, China bears the burden of proving it's own innocence regarding the claims of crimes against humanity and ethnicities in China.

Chinese re-education, labor and prison camps are notoriously secretive and hard to get cameras into.

the crimes against humanity and ethnicities that China is accused of are so horrendous that China has to prove itself innocent of said charges.

the only way to do *that*, is to allow any camera team from anywhere at all times full access to all of China's re-education, labor and prison camps.

failure to do so will surely lead to increasingly stiff boycotts and sanctions getting placed on China by the rest of the world..
so US treating China like an enemy can level any sort of vicious accusation at china, and china has to prove itself innocent? No, it doesn't work this way, the party making the accusation has to provide evidence, otherwise US can constantly make vicious accusation against china, and China has to constantly force itself to open up for CIA agents for "inspection". US makes accusation, US has to provide evidence, period. US will never allow itself for investigation. After international court accused US of war crimes in Afghanistan, which drew international condemnation, and UN started investigation, guess what US did? US sanctioned judges in the UN court, effectively blocked international court investigation of US war crimes.

The Iraqi WMD issue is exactly the reason why US has to provide proof when it makes accusation. European went along with the American lies without demanding US providing proofs of WMD, and now over 2M innocent are dead in Iraq due to American atrocious war crime committed there and no WMD were ever found. US lies, it then invades, it proves over and over why the party making lies and accusations have to show the proof first.

Guess how much overall chinese population has dropped in the same period? Intentionally only picking out Uyghur numbers yet ignore overall drop in population growth rate of entire China? As people become richer, they tend to have less children, and the increasing cost of educating child is also an issue, why are these not factored in?
 
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master_13

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So it's okay to let the uighurs be genocided because Israel is doing it to the palestinian?

How about you condemn both & call out both country.

I know super hard right?
There are tons of pictures and videos of Palestinian being bombed to dust by Israel using American provided bombs, while there hasn't been a single dead body US can provide as proof of so called "Uyghur genocide". Besides Xinjiang is a tourist hotspot, tons of foreign and Chinese tourist go there each day, so you saying China want foreigner tourists to go there to witness "genocide" themselves? What's surprising is that many of you are against propaganda when US media smears against Muslims, yet when US media smears against china, all you thinks its the truth.
 

PeaceGen

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so US treating China like an enemy can level any sort of vicious accusation at china, and china has to prove itself innocent? No, it doesn't work this way, the party making the accusation has to provide evidence, otherwise US can constantly make vicious accusation against china, and China has to constantly force itself to open up for CIA agents for "inspection". US makes accusation, US has to provide evidence, period. US will never allow itself for investigation. After international court accused US of war crimes in Afghanistan and started investigation, guess what US did? US sanctioned judges in the UN court, effectively blocked international court investigation of US war crimes.

The Iraqi WMD issue is exactly the reason why US has to provide proof when it makes accusation. European went along with the American lies without demanding US providing proofs of WMD, and now over 2M innocent are dead in Iraq due to American atrocious war crime committed there and no WMD were ever found. US lies, it then invades, it proves over and over why the party making lies and accusations have to show the proof first.
according to wikipedia at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War, the highest confirmed number of casualties in the Iraq war was one million, not two. Other equally independent estimates put the number much lower.

The Central Tibetan Administration claimed that the number that have died of starvation, violence, or other indirect causes since 1950 is approximately 1.2 million.[64]
but my main point here is this :
blaming the other side for their misconduct during wars and population control missions ultimately leads to an atmosphere (on an entire forum, as we see these days on defence.pk) of warmongering, and likely also lead to more of the same (mass-)suffering you claim to find morally detestable (and rightfully so, we agree on this point actually).

it takes actual peacemaker skills and courage, to look at, and write to, one's own government party/parties and media organisations to help prevent such repeats of horrible events and practices.
and for the record : i already do this.

it's ok for you all to point out what the west can do better, and what it had better not repeat.
but if you do so without adressing your own gorram governments about what *they* do wrong to people under *their* control, then i won't take you seriously.

and you're completely crazy when you say evidence has to be provided by the accuser, while the accused keeps the facilities where the accusations lead to are kept under a tight lock and seal.
There are tons of pictures and videos of Palestinian being bombed to dust by Israel using American provided bombs, while there hasn't been a single dead body US can provide as proof of so called "Uyghur genocide". Besides Xinjiang is a tourist hotspot, tons of foreign and Chinese tourist go there each day, so you saying China want foreigner tourists to go there to witness "genocide" themselves? What's surprising is that many of you are against propaganda when US media smears against Muslims, yet when US media smears against china, all you thinks its the truth.
once again, the facilities where these crimes against humanity happen in China, are kept under a very tight lock and secrecy, even flat-out denial.

your response to the accusations is not good enough, Chinese.
far from it.
 

master_13

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according to wikipedia at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War, the highest confirmed number of casualties in the Iraq war was one million, not two. Other equally independent estimates put the number much lower.



but my main point here is this :
blaming the other side for their misconduct during wars and population control missions ultimately leads to an atmosphere (on an entire forum, as we see these days on defence.pk) of warmongering, and likely also lead to more of the same (mass-)suffering you claim to find morally detestable (and rightfully so, we agree on this point actually).

it takes actual peacemaker skills and courage, to look at, and write to, one's own government party/parties and media organisations to help prevent such repeats of horrible events and practices.
and for the record : i already do this.

it's ok for you all to point out what the west can do better, and what it had better not repeat.
but if you do so without adressing your own gorram governments about what *they* do wrong to people under *their* control, then i won't take you seriously.

and you're completely crazy when you say evidence has to be provided by the accuser, while the accused keeps the facilities where the accusations lead to are kept under a tight lock and seal.

once again, the facilities where these crimes against humanity happen in China, are kept under a very tight lock and secrecy, even flat-out denial.

your response to the accusations is not good enough, Chinese.
far from it.
accuser providing evidence is the bedrock of every country's legal system, it's not crazy, it's the norm. US sanctioned UN court judges for investigating US massive war crimes, and it blocked any investigation into its crime, so china will not take US seriously when US asks China to open it itself up for inspection, especially when it can't even provide one single first hand concrete proof. You talk about "secret" facilities, no, china has no obligation to open itself up for any foreign inspection just because you are accusing it, unless you can provide one single concrete proof to date, which US has provided none, zero. Same thing, US will never allow itself for international inspection either, despite massive war crimes it committed around the world.
 

PeaceGen

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accuser providing evidence is the bedrock of every country's legal system, it's not crazy, it's the norm. US sanctioned UN court judges for investigating US massive war crimes, and it blocked any investigation into its crime, so china will not take US seriously when US asks China to open it itself up for inspection, especially when it can't even provide one single first hand concrete proof. You talk about "secret" facilities, no, china has no obligation to open itself up for any foreign inspection just because you are accusing it, unless you can provide one single concrete proof to date, which US has provided none, zero. Same thing, US will never allow itself for international inspection either, despite massive war crimes it committed around the world.
actually both the accuser and the accused have to provide evidence and witness accounts in any legal trial.

there has over the past few years been an increasing amount of detail reported in western media, but all you Chinese do is deny and deflect with a certain dispicable kind of veiled arrogance.

you want evidence?
ok..


i'm not saying China should not combat terrorism or seperatism.
i'm saying it should be done with detective work and special ops work,
rather than mass-incarceration, forced mass-indoctrination and random torture.

China needs to provide a constant stream of *evidence* of it's innocence.

Or we will have every reason to start to boycot the Chinese economy by making our own economies produce and consume locally or with new allies (India, Africa, South-America), and sanction Chinese leaders.
 

master_13

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actually both the accuser and the accused have to provide evidence and witness accounts in any legal trial.

there has over the past few years been an increasing amount of detail reported in western media, but all you Chinese do is deny and deflect with a certain dispicable kind of veiled arrogance.

you want evidence?
ok..


i'm not saying China should not combat terrorism or seperatism.
i'm saying it should be done with detective work and special ops work,
rather than mass-incarceration, forced mass-indoctrination and random torture.

China needs to provide a constant stream of *evidence* of it's innocence.

Or we will have every reason to start to boycot the Chinese economy by making our own economies produce and consume locally or with new allies (India, Africa, South-America), and sanction Chinese leaders.
no, you are wrong, only the accused has to provide evidence. If accuser can't provide evidence to prove the other party is guilty, even if the accused sits on his butt the whole time without doing anything, then the accused still walks free. That's the bedrock of "presumption of innocence", you are guilty only when you are proven guilty. The "increasing" amount of detail from western media are nothing but circumstantial at best, none of them can stand up in the court of law, if you accusing "genocide", you need to provide some dead bodies, to date, west hasn't provided a single dead body attributable to "genocide". You think if it's "genocide", there has to be vast amount of dead people, but west has failed in even providing one. I don't deny human rights abuse has happened in China, so does the US, but to accuse "genocide"? that's a high hurdle to clear in order to prove.
 

PeaceGen

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no, you are wrong, only the accused has to provide evidence. If accuser can't provide evidence to prove the other party is guilty, even if the accused sits on his butt the whole time without doing anything, then the accused still walks free. That's the bedrock of "presumption of innocence", you are guilty only when you are proven guilty. The "increasing" amount of detail from western media are nothing but circumstantial at best, none of them can stand up in the court of law, if you accusing "genocide", you need to provide some dead bodies, to date, west hasn't provided a single dead body attributable to "genocide". You think if it's "genocide", there has to be vast amount of dead people, but west has failed in even providing one. I don't deny human rights abuse has happened in China, so does the US, but to accuse "genocide"? that's a high hurdle to clear in order to prove.
well, when it comes to crimes against humanity and genocide, as well as WMD development programs, the accused has to prove their innocence.
such was the case for Saddam, such is the case for Iran and North Korea, and it should be no different for China either, in my opinion.

while the Saddam and Iran situations are handled with covert ops and military missions, the China dilemma will i think be handled by economic sanctions and boycotts that drive production work orders out of China and into the consuming nations (US, EU, India, Africa, South-America).

as far as providing evidence goes, here's another one:
 

master_13

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well, when it comes to crimes against humanity and genocide, as well as WMD development programs, the accused has to prove their innocence.
such was the case for Saddam, such is the case for Iran and North Korea, and it should be no different for China either, in my opinion.

while the Saddam and Iran situations are handled with covert ops and military missions, the China dilemma will i think be handled by economic sanctions and boycotts that drive production work orders out of China and into the consuming nations (US, EU, India, Africa, South-America).

as far as providing evidence goes, here's another one:
what makes you think " crimes against humanity and genocide, as well as WMD development programs, the accused has to prove their innocence"? Does that mean others can accuse you with lies constantly, and you have to constantly prove innocence? Guess what, countries like US will never bother to prove its innocence for its own crime against humanity such as war crime in Afghanistan, the US just sanction the international court of justice judges. US even released convicted mass civilian killer soldier in 2018, who killed numerous innocent civilians in Iraq, who was convicted in US own court, and US released him and called him a patriot. Guess what, US doesn't care and won't ever show any proof to prove its innocence or allow any international inspection for its own crimes. No wonder China doesn't take US call for inspection seriously.

Again, a BBC article? really? still no dead body to show? I don't even bother reading any BBC article, which known for anti-china agenda, show me a dead body first for the so called "genocide".
 
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Reashot Xigwin

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Ana, is that you. Ana???
TYT stooge like you support them because you are exposed as MSM shill.And you like being shills. Why even exist if you sound like Rachel Maddow. Did you see the Roger Waters interview in Katie Helper show. That was golden, isn’t it. He tore you up, Ana.
At least I know where u stands Tankie that makes it easier for me. Also the point of any news orgs is to report facts not spout government propaganda. Grayzone has posted that white helmet are terrorists despite overwhelming evidence that it was assad's

Are the Syrian 'White Helmets' Rescue Organization Terrorists? | Snopes.com

So if grayzone lied about this what else could they be lying about? Maybe about the genocide in xinjiang.

China’s Uyghur genocide is undeniable (msn.com)

If anyone wondering what tankie means it's this:
Joshua Collins on Twitter: "1) A THREAD on tankie twitter: Its worth the time to take a look at this batshit crazy movement. Let's start by defining the term In 1956 a student rebellion erupted in Hungary, citing Stalins purges as murders, and the labor camps as State slavery https://t.co/iAaLoDEFyC" / Twitter
 

faithfulguy

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At least I know where u stands Tankie that makes it easier for me. Also the point of any news orgs is to report facts not spout government propaganda. Grayzone has posted that white helmet are terrorists despite overwhelming evidence that it was assad's

Are the Syrian 'White Helmets' Rescue Organization Terrorists? | Snopes.com

So if grayzone lied about this what else could they be lying about? Maybe about the genocide in xinjiang.

China’s Uyghur genocide is undeniable (msn.com)

If anyone wondering what tankie means it's this:
Joshua Collins on Twitter: "1) A THREAD on tankie twitter: Its worth the time to take a look at this batshit crazy movement. Let's start by defining the term In 1956 a student rebellion erupted in Hungary, citing Stalins purges as murders, and the labor camps as State slavery https://t.co/iAaLoDEFyC" / Twitter
Ana, you do ad hominem attacks way too much. Grayzone exposed Russia gate. Also, you must think Julian Assange is a bad guy for exposed establishment corruption. Grayzone has critically acclaimed journalists such as Blumenthal, Mate and Norton. MSM hate them. But you like them as you are paid well by your masters, Ana.
 

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