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All Pakistani banks refuse to open LCs for Russian crude oil import

Samlee

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Simple Russian oil company supplies oil to Pakistani refineries Pakistani refineries pay to rice and sugar exporters who supply Russian trade houses with the required rice and sugar and those trade houses make payments to the Russian oil companies
 

Hyde

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Europe is still the worlds largest importer of Russian hydrocarbons. Fact.

America is importing Russian oil via Indian refineries. Fact.

Arabs still have positive relationships with India and China the 2nd and 3rd largest importers of Russian oil. Fact.


If you are a Pakistani Beggars Can't be Choosers Slave mentality.... Then I guess I'm your master as an American.
First of all, I am not your elder brother who would laugh on your senseless/silly jokes of slave-master. I am not your father who would scold you to write in decent language so if you used such language again, I will have to use the stick to send you on break.

I will not reply to your message as your facts are factually incorrect and there is no need to repeat the same thing over and over again. I have presented my argument in various posts with at least 30-40 objections on such possibly at near future.

The only thing I would like to worth mentioning is… this sudden love for Russia among Pakistani people makes no sense keeping the history of our two nations. Most people in favour of importing oil from Russia are pro-PTI but they deliberately ignore the hurdles of such potential. I have repeatedly given reasons for that such as Arabs offering credit for buying oil from them. Arab nations are next door whereas Russia is in Europe and their land route does not exist so far. The situation in Afghanistan is not peaceful to use the road route and such a project will be costly this greatly reducing the potential of buying from Russia at cheaper cost. The sea route also faces security issues. I am busy right now but have presented multiple arguments for that
 

313ghazi

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First of all, I am not your elder brother who would laugh on your senseless/silly jokes of slave-master. I am not your father who would scold you to write in decent language so if you used such language again, I will have to use the stick to send you on break.

I will not reply to your message as your facts are factually incorrect and there is no need to repeat the same thing over and over again. I have presented my argument in various posts with at least 30-40 objections on such possibly at near future.

The only thing I would like to worth mentioning is… this sudden love for Russia among Pakistani people makes no sense keeping the history of our two nations. Most people in favour of importing oil from Russia are pro-PTI but they deliberately ignore the hurdles of such potential. I have repeatedly given reasons for that such as Arabs offering credit for buying oil from them. Arab nations are next door whereas Russia is in Europe and their land route does not exist so far. The situation in Afghanistan is not peaceful to use the road route and such a project will be costly this greatly reducing the potential of buying from Russia at cheaper cost. I am busy right now but have presented multiple arguments for that

The love is for cheap oil. Which in turn would reduce inflation across the country.

If the commercial banks won't pay for it, the state Bank should.

If you don't buy cheaper oil your economy will collapse. If you do buy cheaper oil then foreign sanctions might collapse your economy.

Great choice. Long term the path of independence is the better one. Either way we're paying a short term price.
 

Waterboy

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as I argued couple of weeks ago, it makes no sense to buy oil from Russia right now. Russia is not China where we can consider taking a risk of compromising our relationship with Arab World, Europe and USA.

For a common Pakistani, The simple definition of Russia is that its friend of India. If we want to better our ties with Russia we should engage with them about future prospects but implement that vision after the war with Ukraine is over.
Thick skinned PTI folks won't accept this. They're nostalgic and doing all sort of weird gymnastics that russian oil would have saved us. I wonder what thier IQ is, Most likely whatsapp warriors.
 

PradoTLC

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View attachment 858599
  • Banks say payment in dollars not possible against import of Russian oil.
  • Commercial banks cite Russia-Ukraine war reason for not opening LCs.
  • Oil refineries also cite several problems in importing crude oil from Russia.
ISLAMABAD: All Pakistani commercial banks have refused to open letters of credit (LCs) for Russian-origin crude oil in the light of economic sanctions by the United States, the United Kingdom and the European Union against Moscow for invading Ukraine, The News reported Saturday.
The commercial banks, according to the publication, have stated that payment in US dollars is not possible against the import of Russian crude oil.
However, if the government manages to enter a G2G agreement with Russia for the import of crude oil under transaction mode based on the rouble — ensuring no impact of sanctions on Pakistan — the refineries can utilise crude oil up to 15-30%, keeping in view its technical suitability for making finished products.
On the other hand, the refineries are in their short and long-term agreements with Abu Dhabi National Oil Company (ADNOC), Aramco, and Kuwait Petroleum Corporation (KPC) for crude oil imports.
More importantly, the current transportation freight for imports from Russian ports is estimated in the range of $3-3.5 million compared to the current freight of $0.8-1.0 from the Middle East ports and the sea voyage from the Black Sea would be around 16-26 days compared to 4-5 days from the Middle East.
This means that the freight charges, from Russia’s ports to Karachi, stand at $8 per barrel which is 8-12 times higher in comparison to the United Arab Emirates (UAE) ports.

Related items​


This is the essence of the written responses of four refineries — PARCO, BYCO (Cnergyico Pk Limited), PRL, and NRL — to the government against letters written to them on June 27, seeking recommendations on five issues, which included the technical suitability of the Russian crude oil, quality and grades, cost of transportation and freight charges, payment mechanism, and existing terms of the contract.

Can utilise Russian oil up to 15-30%: PARCO​

According to the copy of the written responses available with The News, Pak-Arab Refinery (PARCO) said that a detailed technical analysis of processing Russian crude oil can be assessed based on the crude oil blend of Russian grades along with the current grades.
The PARCO wants to ask for samples of Russian grades like SOKO, ESPO and URALA, and Serbia Light, saying it can utilise Russian crude oil up to 15-30% keeping in view its technical suitability for making the finished products.
PARCO said at the maximum, it can import one or two cargoes of 70,000MT to process in a month as most of the Russian crude oils are heavier than its imported grades, therefore, to manage product mix, these can be processed by replacing the Arab Light crude oil.

High freight charges​

BYCO refinery, which imported two Russian crude oil cargoes in the past, has said that the voyage time from Russian ports to Karachi varies from 28-37 days and freight charges are 8-12 times higher in comparison to the UAE ports.
Since a very limited number of vessels are reporting at the Russian ports due to the risk of sanctions, this can further increase the freight charges. Cnergyico also asked Pakistan and Russian governments to decide on an effective payment channel because as per prevailing conditions, it will be difficult for commercial banks to open LCs due to the risk of sanctions.
It also says that it's crude procurement maintains a balance between spot and term cargoes for a particular quarter based on market fundamentals. However, the BYCO refinery says it can absorb some of the Russian crude oil.
More importantly, the Russian crude oils vary from field to field and some of them are technically suitable keeping in view each refinery configuration.

Difficulties in product disposal​

PRL said that it has graded three Russian crudes that including SOKOL, ESPO, and URAL. SOKOL crude oil is the first preference in terms of quality grading, ESPO second, and URAL comes third in terms of preference.
While, the PRL said that SOKOL is a light and sweet crude, it has higher middle distillates and low fuel oil contents. SOKOL would always be the first-choice crude for PRL when compared with other available grades.
It said that the ESPO is fairly sweeter crude with a medium-light blend. However, its only demerit is the higher quantum of fuel oil, and its disposal will always be a daunting task the URAL, PRL says, it’s a mix of both heavy, light and sour crudes.
Urals Sulphur content varies from 1.4% to 2.%. Higher Sulphur content variation in this crude will naturally reflect in its product slate, thereby making it difficult for the refiner to stipulate product Sulphur specifications.
This crude also contains higher volumes of fuel oil and will always pose difficulties in product disposal. Mentioning transportation and freight analysis for import from Russia crude oil in comparison with the normal imports from the Middle East, the PRL said it imports a major chunk of its crude oil from the Middle East region, where freight varies between $1.0-1.5 per barrel. And Freight charges from the KOZMINO port of Russia to Karachi are $8.0/barrel as quoted by the national carrier as a provisional quote.
The PRL also mentioned that the sea voyage time from KOZMINO port to Karachi is approximately 22 days.
About the existing commitment to upliftment from the Arab Gulf region concerning term contracts, the PRL said that according to current term contracts with ADNOC, ARAMCO and KPC 1.2 million MT/ 9.0 million barrels per year are required to be uplifted.
The PRL said after fulfilling its current crude oil term, contract obligations can explore the possibility of processing an additional 300,000-400,000 MT per year.

Route likely to pass through war zones​

The NRL, in its one-page response, said that currently LCs are not being confirmed by the international banks because of the country's risk and commercial banks are not inclined to open LCs for the import of Russian crude oil in the presence of sanctions against Russia.
It also said that the normal sailing time from the Middle East is about four days, whereas it is estimated that the voyage time (one way) would be 20 days from Russia.
Moreover, the route is likely to pass through war zones owing to which risk factors will increase manifold. The NRL suggested the government carve out a doable payments mechanism.


Geo tv is noonie TV …

A whore would have more independence
 

farok84

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I will not reply to your message as your facts are factually incorrect and there is no need to repeat the same thing over and over again.

Hi,

All three facts he mentioned are broadly factual. Please read the following report for better understanding.

1. Europe is still the worlds largest importer of Russian hydrocarbons. Fact.

2.
Arabs still have positive relationships with India and China the 2nd and 3rd largest importers of Russian oil. Fact. (China and India are fighting it out for 2nd and 3rd place)


1656793267346.png

1656793534541.png

1656793788719.png


Even, UAE imported couple of cargoes of Russian crude themselves, why will they have any issues?

1656793953213.png


3. America is importing Russian oil via Indian refineries. Fact.

1656794428633.png



There are always work arounds, evident from Greece, Norway and UK tankers transporting 90% of Russian crude to the world.

1656794351993.png



@Clutch Please add on if I have missed any details.


Atleast, now the argument that whether Pakistan refineries are technically capable to refine Russian crude, has been finally settled.
 

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Clutch

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First of all, I am not your elder brother who would laugh on your senseless/silly jokes of slave-master. I am not your father who would scold you to write in decent language so if you used such language again, I will have to use the stick to send you on break.

I will not reply to your message as your facts are factually incorrect and there is no need to repeat the same thing over and over again. I have presented my argument in various posts with at least 30-40 objections on such possibly at near future.

The only thing I would like to worth mentioning is… this sudden love for Russia among Pakistani people makes no sense keeping the history of our two nations. Most people in favour of importing oil from Russia are pro-PTI but they deliberately ignore the hurdles of such potential. I have repeatedly given reasons for that such as Arabs offering credit for buying oil from them. Arab nations are next door whereas Russia is in Europe and their land route does not exist so far. The situation in Afghanistan is not peaceful to use the road route and such a project will be costly this greatly reducing the potential of buying from Russia at cheaper cost. The sea route also faces security issues. I am busy right now but have presented multiple arguments for that

Read the post #22 by farok84 who provides answers to your rebuttal that there are no facts to support my claim.


On a side note, what language did I use that shattered your fragile ego?...:give me a quote.

Btw... I am not pro- Imran Khan or pro-PTI. Although, I do think they are the best option from the lot. Ian not even pro-Russia. Its childish to think of thinks in binary terms. I am very much so disillusioned in Pakistan and it's trajectory.
 
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Hyde

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Read the post #22 by farok84 who provides answers to your rebuttal that there are no facts to support my claim.


On a side note, what language did I use that shattered your fragile ego?...:give me a quote.

Btw... I am not pro- Imran Khan or pro-PTI. Although, I do think they are the best option from the lot. Ian not even pro-Russia. Its childish to think of thinks in binary terms. I am very much so disillusioned in Pakistan and it's trajectory.
I am super busy today as I am still at work and it's 11:20pm already. Your taunt of master-slave was a cheap call. I was trying to engage in serious discussion until that point when I realized you will resort to unnecessary taunts and indecent language, period. Other MODs usually ban straight away but I try not to use force.

The only thing I want to mention right now before getting to work is that our Pakistani people have this habit of deviating from topic by mentioning irrelevant information. For example in the first post you quoted, I never asked for other countries info and was focused on Pakistan but the discussion was leading elsewhere. The facts presented by you and faruk are not complete picture as you need to analyze these facts under various context to get the clear picture. For example Russia has energy pipelines on Europe, it has established routes and contacts with many European countries so EU cannot replace Russia overnight but what we most realise is how quickly the EU is trying to replace Russia with USA, Norway and other countries. It's an effort worth commendable

The relationship of Pakistan and Russia is not like India-Russia or China-Russia who are partners for a very long time....

Gotta go now
 

Clutch

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I am super busy today as I am still at work and it's 11:20pm already. Your taunt of master-slave was a cheap call. I was trying to engage in serious discussion until that point when I realized you will resort to unnecessary taunts and indecent language, period. Other MODs usually ban straight away but I try not to use force.

The only thing I want to mention right now before getting to work is that our Pakistani people have this habit of deviating from topic by mentioning irrelevant information. For example in the first post you quoted, I never asked for other countries info and was focused on Pakistan but the discussion was leading elsewhere. The facts presented by you and faruk are not complete picture as you need to analyze these facts under various context to get the clear picture. For example Russia has energy pipelines on Europe, it has established routes and contacts with many European countries so EU cannot replace Russia overnight but what we most realise is how quickly the EU is trying to replace Russia with USA, Norway and other countries. It's an effort worth commendable

The relationship of Pakistan and Russia is not like India-Russia or China-Russia who are partners for a very long time....

Gotta go now

I'll let you get back to work. But as a FYI... I've been on this forum as long as you if not longer and have never been banned for any reason. If I was someone who uses foul language or personal attacks, I wouldn't have lasted this long. Let's not allow admin powers to get to our heads... Just saying.


European pipelines are one thing. LNG can be efficiently transported via oceanic tankers. The bottle neck is not in the decompression (offloading) it's the compression of LNG which Russia already does well that needs complex facilities. So really the whole issue of not importing Russian LNG is bogus. Russian crude oil and it's grade (i.e. API) and the fact that Pakistani refineries are not tooled accordingly is a reasonable argument.
 

Silverblaze

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I am super busy today as I am still at work and it's 11:20pm already. Your taunt of master-slave was a cheap call. I was trying to engage in serious discussion until that point when I realized you will resort to unnecessary taunts and indecent language, period. Other MODs usually ban straight away but I try not to use force.

The only thing I want to mention right now before getting to work is that our Pakistani people have this habit of deviating from topic by mentioning irrelevant information. For example in the first post you quoted, I never asked for other countries info and was focused on Pakistan but the discussion was leading elsewhere. The facts presented by you and faruk are not complete picture as you need to analyze these facts under various context to get the clear picture. For example Russia has energy pipelines on Europe, it has established routes and contacts with many European countries so EU cannot replace Russia overnight but what we most realise is how quickly the EU is trying to replace Russia with USA, Norway and other countries. It's an effort worth commendable

The relationship of Pakistan and Russia is not like India-Russia or China-Russia who are partners for a very long time....

Gotta go now

Mohataram

Money talks. Russia is in a state of war and need cash, it does not matter to them what 'relation' we have or dont have with them. We are not buying s-500s from them.

Russian oil is a commodity out there to be bought simple. Why make it complicated? Deny somethign, delay it, make it controversial and then forget about it.

Pakistani bureaucracy plays these tricks to perfection.

 

Olympus81

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It all boils down to Pakistan’s poor foreign policy and slave mentality.

A prudent foreign policy would suggest relations with all countries, even your enemies.

Afghan war and Soviet’s breakup was a good 3 decades ago and the absence of any decent relationship between Pakistan and Russia can best be attributed to lack of foresight.

Coming to the present scenario. Is it in Pakistan’s interest

1. To improve relations with Russia?
2. To diversify it’s oil supplies?
3. To take advantage of cheaper oil?
4. To import wheat from Russia?

Answer is simple. Even China, our friend, asked us to improve relations with Russia.

We know by now, some refineries in Pakistan can refine Russian oil. Also we do know for a fact that Russian wheat can be consumed by Pakistanis like what our long time American friends would like us to believe.
 

Finer

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Europe is still the worlds largest importer of Russian hydrocarbons. Fact.

America is importing Russian oil via Indian refineries. Fact.

Arabs still have positive relationships with India and China the 2nd and 3rd largest importers of Russian oil. Fact.


If you are a Pakistani Beggars Can't be Choosers Slave mentality.... Then I guess I'm your master as an American.
Europe is next to Russia.
America relies on India for cheap Russian oils.
Arab have diplomatic relationship means nothing to Pakistan in terms of refinery and delivery.

It is physically impossible to import cheaper oil from Russia due to land-locked. Due to lack of refineries, and able to access cheaper oil of Russia relies on neighbors that sells for cheaper which is sanctioned while others sell for high value shares long-term relationship with Pakistan.

We are talking about importing oils from Russia - not Gawadar port that connects to neighbours. Diplomatic is moot point since it is impossible to import cheaper oil from Russia due to land-locked that will result higher cost of freights along with storage using sophisticated systems using Russian currency that is not worth the value.

In comparison to Arab and American worlds where remittance plays huge role in keeping Pakistan alive. As for inflation, it is gift from worlds that has nothing to do with Pakistan. It is just Pakistan pays the price of inflation that is due to geopolitical tensions and economy hostage/monopoly.
 

Wood

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If a 35% rebate on oil is agreed with the Russians we will still gain a huge amount of rebate . Even at 30% rebate you gain 39 dollars given a130 dollar price. Add 8 dollars as excess freight. We require 550 bpd and local refineries can refine 60% of this locally ( roughly 310bpd). Even if we can get 100Bpd via Russia at 99 dollars saving us 31 dollars it amounts to 1/5 of our requirements. Over all we will save roughly 5.5dollars per barrel. This amounts to 2-3% off of our export bills of 20billion dollars.A 600 million dollar rebate which is 600 million more than we currently have. A lot Of what is being said is in support of individual's properties in the US by towing the US line.
A
India gets $35 discount and $25 of the $35 is spent on freight and insurance. Russia has hinted that these discounts will be reviewed and so it cannot last forever. What if Pakistan looses its GDP+ status in EU because of this? The export industry will suffer for effectively a $10 discount.
 

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