Why America is hated in the Middle-east?

Discussion in 'Americas' started by A.Rahman, Aug 16, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. A.Rahman

    A.Rahman ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,718
    Ratings:
    +0 / 436 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Canada
    Maybe this is why people hate USA in middle-east:

    1) The Eisenhower administration's CIA brought down a popular representative government in Iran, in 1953, because Mosaddeq, the prime minister, wanted to nationalise Iran's oil. America installed, nurtured, cradled, and propped the Shah for the next 25 years no matter how dictatorial and oppressive he became. This behavior, of course, led to the bloody Islamic revolution in Iran. You have to SAY this, and to put the blame where it belongs: OUR CIA, and OUR foreign policy. Show us that you are a free press, and not the propaganda division of the US government.

    2) Saddam Hussein is another CIA creation. We call him a 'Hitler' now, but he comes with a "Made in America" label stamped on the back of his neck. He was our man even before he rose to power, and we encouraged him to wage a bloody war against Iran over a few square meters of real-estate. We needed to hit Iran hard, thru Iraq, because Iran had become dangerously anti-American because...uh huh...you begin to see the problem.

    3) Saddam thought he had our blessing for everything. We had never stopped him before (not even when he used chemical weapons against his own population), and we had been supplying him with weapons. That is why he attacked Kuwait, the deliverance of which cost American lives.

    4)Afghanistan started talking about a holy war against the Soviet imperialists, the CIA thought, "Great! Let's get this started and launch millions of Muslims against our Cold War opponents." So we fostered, encouraged, and funded this holy war of the mujahideen. Osama bin Laden was our ally, spending his own money and organizing people on the ground, as well as bringing them from all parts of the Islamic world. WE built the network that is bin Laden's Al Qaeda.

    5) When it became necessary to deliver Kuwait from OUR violent protegé Saddam Hussein, American troops were stationed in Saudi Arabia, bin Laden's homeland. But they never left, and this is holy soil. This insult is added to the fact that we had been supporting the royal family there for long even though they run the country in dictatorial fashion and are widely hated. That is what made bin Laden our enemy. We had already built him up into a powerful warlord, and now he had gotten out of control. Sounds like Saddam? Yes it does.


    6) When the Islamic party in Algeria won in fair and free elections, we supported the violent crackdown of the military because, it was said, the Islamicists would abolish democracy. So we made sure it was abolished before the Islamicists had a chance to try. It is hard to convey just how bloody the rampages that followed have been. Many of these were carried out by the GIA (thought responsible for the massacres of tens of thousands of civilians), a group led by veterans of the Afghan war and trained by bin Laden's network It is hard to believe that the Islamicists would have been worse. But we will never know, because America hates democratic outcomes. What it likes is tin-pot dictators that are obliged in clientship relationships to the United States. Of course, this is very dangerous. But it keeps happening because what each President keeps thinking about is the next election, not long-term outcomes, and Americans don't read History.

    7) Finally, we have been supporting Israel since its inception, even though it is a state born of terrorist violence, and even though its abuses have been many. Menachem Begin, one of the first prime-ministers of Israel, used to be a wanted terrorist with a bounty on his head. But who knows this? Do you? Americans don't read history. They are not interested. YOU MUST BRING THIS UP. The Palestinians are guilty of crimes as well, but we have never shown an even hand in the region: we mostly condemn the crimes of the Palestinians, the crimes of the weak. We have been Israel's unconditional allies.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 4
  2. A.Rahman

    A.Rahman ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,718
    Ratings:
    +0 / 436 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Canada
    This list is incomplete. However, it brings into relief that the claim that Americans are hated because of their "culture" is total madness. It will not help Americans understand why they have been attacked. Please: Educate Americans about this history. Stay away from the ridiculous claims that we are hated because we respect individual liberties. In the Muslim world, over and over again, we consistently HAVE NOT respected individual liberties but rather supported tin-pot dictators. Therefore, the claim that we are hated because of our "culture" is a complete travesty of the truth. Before the fiasco in Iran, Americans were perceived all over the Muslim world as a benign world power. The hated powers were the colonialists: France and Britain. American culture was not radically different then. Women showed their skin, unmarried people kissed in movies, there was pornography, drinking, etc. If we were really hated for our "culture" this hate should have peaked in the 60's. It is peaking NOW. Now that we have become much more conservative than in that decade.

    Patriotism means NOT BEING PROPAGANDISTS FOR THE GOVERNMENT. Patriotism, for you, and for me, and for all of us, means not allowing the truth to be the first casualty of war.
     
  3. Tiki Tam Tam

    Tiki Tam Tam <b>MILITARY PROFESSIONALS</b>

    Joined:
    May 15, 2006
    Messages:
    9,334
    Ratings:
    +0 / 2,585 / -0
    Any community that wallows in self pity is doomed.

    The Middle East is thus doomed.

    If they were keen on making a mark in the world, they should have not bothered in hating or loving anyone. They should have worked hard and made people love them.

    China is an example of making the world love them, even if internally they hate them!

    One can dislike China's form of governance, but you cannot ignore them!

    Indeed, if the ME has accepted CIA "stooges", it indicates how mindless and characterless the ME population is. Even the Shieks and Kings of the ME are stooges of the US.

    Why blame the US?

    If stooges likes to have stooges ruling them, so be it.

    In fact, the US is doing some stooges a favour!

    As Rehman, says, let truth not be a casualty for the sake of sentiment!
     
  4. melb4aust

    melb4aust SENIOR MEMBER

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2005
    Messages:
    1,623
    Ratings:
    +0 / 201 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Canada
    Yes why Blame the US,

    when we each an everyone of us is responsible for all this. If all the people, each and everyone of us had the feelings and if we had worked out to counter any one, these things woud'nt have happened at first place.

    Just watch where the muslim world and muslims are standing now, compared to the last 5 decades. So many incidents happened in pasts, still did'nt learn, coud'nt develope ourselves, such sluggishness.

    There is no need to blame the rulers. This is us again each and every one of us because who put them on there, because of us they are there, we all know the reality and truth, but just watching keeping all eyes blind. Its a big shame and i am one of us.
     
  5. Spring Onion

    Spring Onion PDF VETERAN

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2006
    Messages:
    37,283
    Ratings:
    +14 / 28,253 / -1
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Pakistan
    Sir lets US bomb Indian cities, kill thousands of inncocent in the name of liberating you and thn i will ask you do hate them or not or you just want to make a mark in the world by not loving or hating them??
    Easy to say difficuly to feel unless you are not confronted with such a situation.





    Its not the question of who is who's stooge its why US is being hated Sir.
    Its not becuase one's leaders are stooges to US due to which they hate US, its just the policies of US which force the US citizens to feel the burnt of something they themselves are not a party to.
     
  6. Sid

    Sid SENIOR MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2006
    Messages:
    619
    Ratings:
    +0 / 20 / -0
    Well, if the Nepalese people can come out on to the streets and demand democracy and make it happen. I dont see why the ME people can't even try something like that.
     
  7. Thunder

    Thunder SENIOR MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 8, 2005
    Messages:
    1,432
    Ratings:
    +0 / 18 / -0
    They did. Nothing really happened
     
  8. A.Rahman

    A.Rahman ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,718
    Ratings:
    +0 / 436 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Canada
    List of US veto.

    Supporting every illegal action of Isreal blindly, I call this abuse of power.
     
  9. Tiki Tam Tam

    Tiki Tam Tam <b>MILITARY PROFESSIONALS</b>

    Joined:
    May 15, 2006
    Messages:
    9,334
    Ratings:
    +0 / 2,585 / -0
    That is life!

    So long as the world banks on the US munificence, the world will have to accept what they say.

    It may not sound nice, but that is reality of life!
     
  10. A.Rahman

    A.Rahman ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    4,718
    Ratings:
    +0 / 436 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Canada
    and I agree with you salim... bitter reality...
     
  11. Tiki Tam Tam

    Tiki Tam Tam <b>MILITARY PROFESSIONALS</b>

    Joined:
    May 15, 2006
    Messages:
    9,334
    Ratings:
    +0 / 2,585 / -0
    Jana,

    The US will not bomb Indian cities.

    It is a booming market and growing.

    Does marvels for the US economy! ;)

    The reality for the Islamic world is no matter what the people may think, the govts rule the roost and they have teh wherewithal to back up what they feel like doing.

    The people are mere pawns.

    If the people mattered, there would be no Sheiks, Shahs and so called Kings. They are all a creation of history - a history chalked out by the British and French.

    Iraq is an excellent example of the mish mash left behind by the British to suit their convenience. Kuwait is but a district of Iraq but the British made it a country to suit their convenience.
     
  12. Averroes

    Averroes FULL MEMBER

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2006
    Messages:
    452
    Ratings:
    +0 / 16 / -0
    "The United States is the greatest threat to world peace, and has been for a long time, and not merely because it is the world's only superpower. Equally important, the United States is also far more disposed to use its power than any other powerful nation currently is. Though Americans are culturally and emotionally blind to the fact, the mere intrusion of US power is, in and of itself, destabilizing."

    T.D. Allman
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  13. zraver

    zraver PROFESSIONAL

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2006
    Messages:
    487
    Ratings:
    +0 / 191 / -0
    As an American, i find the lack of memory for America's other deeds disturbing.

    Some rebuttals

    1- America did what it did in the Middle East in responce to Soviet efforts at creating client states which would let them control Europes energy supply. The Area was a proxy battle between the super powers for control of Europe. After UK/France cut arms sales to Egypt, Nasser invited in the Soviets to supply him with arms, America had a very small footprin tin the ME. The only people we sold anythign too was Lebanon, Jordan, and Iran. Do any of you remember the many and varied socialist terrorist groups trained and funded by USSR? Or the pan-Arab communist- Baathist movement? The US did not pick the ME as a cold war battlefeild.

    2- Israel, originally only occupied those areas inhabited by Jews. The Palestinians on advice of the Arab goverments rejected the partition plan and said they were going wipe Israel out, this jsut a few short years after Hitler. What was the US supsoed to do, allow genocide? She is also a true democracy, I would point out that until the Lebanese Civil War- Lebanon a fellow democracy was also close to the USA.

    3- The problems in the Middle east begin with British Colonial rule and the dismemberment of the Ottoman Turkish Empire, the divided loyalties and petty tyrants where already there when the US entered the scene during the Cold war.

    4- No nation has done more for Islamic countries than the USA. We have gone to war repeatedly to free Moslems form tyranny or genocide (Bosnia, Kosovo, Iraq, Kuwait, Afghanistan we got Egypt the Suez (form UK/France and israel) and Sinai back. When the Tusami hit US aid form all sources topped 2 billion, when ever there is an earthquake we send relief. We hav eintervened to stop India in your wars verses them when your troops failed and India began to counter attack. We supported Turkey vs Greece on Cyprus etc. And US pressure and intelligence helped force Syria out of Lebanon.

    Taken on a whole, US policy towards the Middle East has been eratic but balanced.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 3
  14. PakSniper

    PakSniper SENIOR MEMBER

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2006
    Messages:
    714
    Ratings:
    +0 / 33 / -0
    but the most important policy is the double standard of israel that is fueling anger, yes were happy aid is given every human with some deceny would give donation to help no matter what the creed....

    But being with Israel and not inforcing laws their and put pressure on arabs and muslims is just wrong. thats from my observation hate builds up..u can't tell iran not to give weapons if u urself is shifting weapons...and i remember quite back US saying stop supplying groups weapons but if u look in the arab and muslim idiology, that is saying isro can kill but the other side can't..so US has to change its policies or most likely it willn't be good, cause the hate that the mulsim public has now will be bought out once this generation become leaders, because of the old generation policies!
     
  15. Bull

    Bull ELITE MEMBER

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2006
    Messages:
    6,850
    Ratings:
    +0 / 270 / -0
    Its just jeoulosy !!! Remember even Chelsea is hatted the most in England, but that doesnt make them any lesser as a team.

    Give OBL a H1B visa and he would happily migrate to US and settle down over there.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.