The Truth Left Behind

[CENTCOM]

A couple of regrettable incidents during the last few weeks seem to have overshadowed the good work done by U.S. and NATO forces in Afghanistan. The video depicting U.S. Marines urinating on Taliban corpses and the unintentional burning of the Holy Koran have prompted an understandable anger from the people of the ****** region. The behavior depicted in the video does not represent the high moral standard we expect of coalition forces. President Obama, Secretary of Defense Panetta, and other senior officials have apologized for the mistaken burning of the Holy Koran, and General John Allen, the ISAF commander, has already taken steps to ensure that this incident doesn’t happen again by mandating additional training for ISAF forces. We are by no means downplaying the seriousness of these incidents, but we want to remind our readers that we have the utmost respect for the people of Afghanistan, their culture, and their religion.

Please click on this link below and see how coalition forces played a major role in refurbishing a grand mosque which was once a crumbling ruin in the isolated village of Khan Neshin.

U.S. Central Command | Afghans refurbish mosque with help from Marine

Please click on this link below and read about a mosque that was jointly reconstructed by Tarok Kolache landowners and ISAF in Arghandab district after it was destroyed by the Taliban.

Mosque Opening Symbolizes Hope, Partnership in Kandahar | ISAF - International Security Assistance Force

While the doubters may continue to exploit these incidents, the truth is that “since 2001, the U.S. government has spent almost $26 million on the program to fund about 640 cultural preservation projects in more than 100 countries,” as mentioned in the article below. The article below also highlights the contributions made by the U.S. to restore mosques around the globe, including Pakistan.

US funds restoration of global Islamic sites | Entertainment | DAWN.COM

Our officials have fully acknowledged the mistakes associated with the incidents mentioned above, and steps are being taken to ensure that the same mistakes are not repeated. These incidents do not reflect the values, morals and ethics of our country or our military. We hope for everyone to realize that the U.S. remains fully committed to the betterment of the region.

Maj David Nevers
DET-United States Central Command
U.S. Central Command

 

[Donatello]

 

[pak-marine]

appreciate efforts by ISAF and Nato in re building trust

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

what are the accomplishments (militarily) after decade + ?

all the gains made in 2004 have been offset by losses in the following years.....it is good that more women are involved in government affairs and public sphere in Afghanistan. More going to school (or so we are told).

i think most americans are simply saying ''they hate us over there, let's get out of that hell-hole''

 

[Jango]

Training does not solve this issue, this goes much more deeper than that, it is embedded in the mindset. No training can help you in that my friend.

The americans have the mindset, modernize everything, problems solved!

 

[Bobshouse]

People are going to find what I say next offensive but I will say it anyway.

The US will never win in Afghanistan and many other theaters of instability because they are applying their own intelligence and hard fought social lessons on a people that are less intelligent than themselves. You cant teach a person calculus that doesnt know how to count, just like you cant teach your average Afghan true respect for women with such a questionable culture overnight.
An interview I saw with an Australian commander pretty much summed it up. He was asked why the Australia was willing to deal with ex warlords and ex druglords who are now in positions of authority when the Dutch wouldnt. He pretty much said we dont have any other option. He said people that make it to the top of Afghanistan echelons get by questionable means. He says you will not find many people in positions of power in Afghanistan that dont have some kind of past. Thats unfortunately the reality.
I worry about Afghanistan, If I were the US I would start with the above being correct and let Afghanistan work out their own mess. Id leave bases within and around the borders and use the old carrot and stick approach.

 

[Kompromat]

People are going to find what I say next offensive but I will say it anyway.

The US will never win in Afghanistan and many other theaters of instability because they are applying their own intelligence and hard fought social lessons on a people that are less intelligent than themselves. You cant teach a person calculus that doesnt know how to count, just like you cant teach your average Afghan true respect for women with such a questionable culture overnight.
An interview I saw with an Australian commander pretty much summed it up. He was asked why the Australia was willing to deal with ex warlords and ex druglords who are now in positions of authority when the Dutch wouldnt. He pretty much said we dont have any other option. He said people that make it to the top of Afghanistan echelons get by questionable means. He says you will not find many people in positions of power in Afghanistan that dont have some kind of past. Thats unfortunately the reality.
I worry about Afghanistan, If I were the US I would start with the above being correct and let Afghanistan work out their own mess. Id leave bases within and around the borders and use the old carrot and stick approach.

What do you expect from a country which has seen nothing but 30 years of consistent war and conflict---Nobel prizes ?

Its actually dumb to ask much of current Afghanistan. Its very easy to sit in Australia during a warm summer on a computer and write some words about Afghanistan & accuse them of being "un-intelligent" without actually having any understanding about the subject.But its very hard to do something practical & real that makes a difference.

One must understand that US and NATO and other allies are not here to help Afghanistan become a better country , but they are rather using it as a launchpad to isolate and contain China and other Asian emerging powers who may in the near future take the "sole superpower" medal from the US which hurts given that it was earned by Nuking civilian cities and invading 75 countries.

Have fun.

 

[Bobshouse]

What do you expect from a country which has seen nothing but 30 years of consistent war and conflict---Nobel prizes ?

Its actually dumb to ask much of current Afghanistan. Its very easy to sit in Australia during a warm summer on a computer and write some words about Afghanistan & accuse them of being "un-intelligent" without actually having any understanding about the subject.But its very hard to do something practical & real that makes a difference.

One must understand that US and NATO and other allies are not here to help Afghanistan become a better country , but they are rather using it as a launchpad to isolate and contain China and other Asian emerging powers who may in the near future take the "sole superpower" medal from the US which hurts given that it was earned by Nuking civilian cities and invading 75 countries.

Have fun.

I expect very little of Afghanistan, to be honest I expect Afghanistan to teeter from failed state to total failure without any support. Thats the point I am trying to make, a traditional military "win" in Afghanistan will not be a possible. The most the US can expect is to limit the people within its borders the ability to launch strikes on other countries and not be a training ground for terrorists.

As far as being dumb to ask much of Afghanistan, I agree. They currently dont have the collective intelligence to run their own country without score settling, violence and tolerance. Yes it is very easy for me to sit here in Australia on a warm summers day and point fingers. Its a sad state of affairs when people on this planet are so far apart, but It still does not take away from the fact that I am correct.

As far as the last paragraph is concerned, I am not going to entertain crazy conspiracy theories. Dont forget why the US invaded in the first place.

The US needs to get the hell out now and start spending the money at home.

 

[Abu Zolfiqar]

Aeronaut & Bob --- some very interesting points made

 

[Kompromat]

I expect very little of Afghanistan, to be honest I expect Afghanistan to teeter from failed state to total failure without any support.

It already is a failed state , it wasn't to begin with , all thanks to Russians and the US who turned it into one.

Thats the point I am trying to make, a traditional military "win" in Afghanistan will not be a possible.

As it has "never" been possible throughout its entire history.

The most the US can expect is to limit the people within its borders the ability to launch strikes on other countries

NO strike on ANY other country has been launched by Afghan people. OBL was an arab & Pakistan and Afghanistan both offered his arrest after 9/11 "peacefully" provided if Americans come up with concrete proofs of his involvement in that pitiful attack. Which is a fundamental right of anyone who is accused of a crime -- am i right? -- US refused and instead started a war , that should be enough to understand that they didn't just wanna get rid of OBL , they had larger geostrategic agenda , which hasn't worked as they wanted it to , which is a different story.

not be a training ground for terrorists.

Americans turned Afghanistan into a training ground for "terrorists" - at that time though they were "Holy Fighters Of God" and enjoyed state dinners with the US presidents at the oval office and were compared with America's founding fathers as their "moral equivalents" - Ironic huh?

Feast your eyes , Taliban leader Jalal-ud-din Haqqani with US president Ronald Regan in the Whitehouse.

As far as being dumb to ask much of Afghanistan, I agree. They currently dont have the collective intelligence to run their own country without score settling, violence and tolerance.

Thanks to countries who didn't let them develop a collective intelligence to govern a country. You tell me , if Australia was occupied from WA to NSW and QLD with unstoppable conflict for 30 years with two full scale invasions and brutal decade long civil war , all of your great universities and political research institutes and all of your infrastructure was turned to rubble by B-52's carrying out carpet bombing missions - would you like to be blamed for not being capable of a "collective intelligence" to run Australia ?

Yes it is very easy for me to sit here in Australia on a warm summers day and point fingers.

Yup , i am not yet expecting Afghan teenagers to go windsurfing and play footy on the weekend either.

Its a sad state of affairs when people on this planet are so far apart, but It still does not take away from the fact that I am correct.

I have similar feelings , but im sure you have room for change as do i.

As far as the last paragraph is concerned, I am not going to entertain crazy conspiracy theories. Dont forget why the US invaded in the first place.

I am not going to defend it as a conspiracy theory but i would rather take it as your lack of knowledge and understanding over this topic. Though i am always open to debate this with "proofs" and facts and figures on the ground at any given time upon your willingness to understand the entire game.

The US needs to get the hell out now and start spending the money at home.

Yea , i am sure Australia can also make good use of 3 billion Australian dollars per year by spending that money on providing better health services for their Aboriginals or providing tax breaks and holding interest rates long term to help local business postpone an inevitable economic crunch for some time.


Regards:

 

[Bobshouse]

Look, im not talking about whats ifs or what if this happened to Australia, I am not giving hypothetical situations or giving an opinions based what we think we know. I am talking about hard cold realities that need to be said. Your analysis of of inevitable outcomes is based purely in speculation. I am obviously not going to deny the destructive forces outsiders have played here, but to say the backwards culture Afghanistan has developed is the entire result of outsiders is a long bow to draw.

As far as OBL and 9/11 is concerned, he had admitted the attacks on a number of videos. A quick youtube search with those keywords show a number of videos. I really dont understand the mentality here. Its like when he was killed, the US, Pakistan, Al-Qaeda and a whole bunch of terrorists organisation acknowledged he was killed but so many people refused to believe it. So you are saying Pakistan had OBL under some kind of arrest and was willing to hand him over if proof was presented? So what a confession by the accused and the massive stockpile of evidence was not enough? Seriously thats BS, the best chance the US had at arresting OBL was at Tora Bora and they stuffed it up.

This conflict is a lost cause based on both parties here.
1. Afghan culture.
2. America's MASSIVE strategic failures of intelligence and understanding of the conflict they are in. If the US wanted to win in Afghanistan it wouldnt have turned its attention to Iraq and overstretched itself. It would need to completely seal off all its borders, pour a massive amounts of troops of the ground and spend billions and billions of dollars over decades on a massive infrastructure and re-education campaign. And that in the current environment is not going to happen, nor would one country want to.

I also make no apologies for bad mouthing a peoples culture. The saying of "you must respect other peoples cultures" is just plain wrong. It an acknowledgment of turning a blind eye to some hideous behavior, I couldnt care less who you are, be Afghan, Australian or a purple talking giraffe. If you dont first of all truly look at the root cause and try to fix that then you will achieve nothing