Indian IT firms employ over 1 lakh in US: Report

Discussion in 'World Affairs' started by CaptainJackSparrow, Mar 23, 2012.

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  1. Vinod2070
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    Vinod2070 ELITE MEMBER

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    Respect!

    That's how it adds up. A 100 here, a thousand there and pretty soon you have the magic 107000.

    The Indian IT industry model has to be necessarily different. The local hires would be more experienced client facing people. The junior back end will be provided by Indians back home.

    This is what even US companies like IBM, HP and every other major IT services company is doing. This is the recipe for success now as much as having your manufacturing supply chain in Asia and mainly China is.
  2. foxbat
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    foxbat SENIOR MEMBER

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    There is no adjustment buddy.. Just careful reading.. Go beyond the headlines and read the report. Have a look at my 1st post on this thread where I put in a screen shot from the report. That will give you all the figures without having to bet or guess.. ;)
  3. Aramsogo
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    Aramsogo FULL MEMBER

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    Yes, but this is Infosys. The biggest and most bad a$$ Indian IT money machine. If Infosys only pulls a 1,000 who's pulling the other 99,000.

    Yes, I understand they want high quality hires in US, not quantity. That is another argument in support of these numbers being grossly inflated.
  4. Vinod2070
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    Vinod2070 ELITE MEMBER

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    Infosys is one of the larger companies. It is not the largest, but second largest and not by a large margin.

    The report talks of only one city. They would have people in several cities in all time zones. Then there are tens of more companies that are doing the same.

    They have 2.8 million people back home. USA provides almost 50% of the industry revenue.

    5% of the people hired in the local geography doesn't look too much knowing how this industry operates.
  5. StingRoy
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    StingRoy SENIOR MEMBER

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    Ahem...
    HCL America: 20 centers across US (HCL America | HCL Offices in United States, Headquartered in Sunnyvale, California , Offshore Software Development, IT Outsourcing | www.hcltech.com)
    Infosys America: 16 centers across US (Infosys - Contact)
    Wipro America: 21 centers across US (North America)
    TCS America: 17 centers across US (North America)

    And this is just 4 of the Indian IT companies (major players) and already they are operating 74 offices across North America. Now even if you count approx 300-400 employees per center it easily makes up 22K to 30K jobs for just these 4 companies alone. There are hundreds of small/medium size IT companies operating in the US... Not that hard to reach a 100,000 figure. Do the maths...
  6. JayAtl
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    JayAtl BANNED

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    You are trying to talk to Chinese guy , who even their own govt. thinks they are too dumb to get to read all news! … you think wait staff out of Chinatown is going to get the obvious?
  7. Aramsogo
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    Aramsogo FULL MEMBER

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    First, the Infosys 1,000 hire is for the entire US, not just Bellevue. Bellevue, WA would be 100+.

    Yes, I can support your 25,000 estimate total employees for the Indian "majors" in the US. You did not pull the numbers out of thin air. But here's the catch, 70% of those 25,000 are H1-B, so they created zero American jobs for Americans. How do I know? Let's look. Wipro is publicly traded on the NYSE. Here's Wipro's 20-F/A Filing from the NYSE.

    WIPRO 20-F
    [Restrictions on immigration in the U.S. may affect our ability to compete for and provide services to clients in the U.S., which could hamper our growth and cause our revenue to decline.
    Our employees who work onsite at client facilities or at our facilities in the U.S. on temporary or extended assignments typically must obtain visas. If U.S. immigration laws change and make it more difficult for us to obtain H-1B and L-1 visas for our employees, our ability to compete for and provide services to our clients in the United States could be impaired. In response to past terrorist attacks in the United States, the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services has increased its level of scrutiny in reviewing visa applications and has decreased the number of grants. These restrictions and any other changes in turn could hamper our growth and cause our revenue to decline.
    A majority of our personnel in the United States hold H-1B visas or L-1 visas. An H-1B visa is a temporary work visa, which allows the employee to remain in the United States while he or she remains an employee of the sponsoring firm.]



    Taking your 25,000 US employees for the Indian IT majors (a number I accept) and let's suppose t 70% of them are H1-Bs (that's being generous - it's probably closer to 90-95%), we are looking at 7,500 American jobs for American citizens. 7,500 Americans is also in line with Infosys hiring 1,000 native Americans workers for the entire US.

    Now for the "dark matter" 75,000 American employees of other smaller Indian IT firms, that number is even more suspicious. I call it "dark matter" because you can't prove it, you just assumed it assists. Why?? Because the small IT firm is a much more fragmented market. It has Americans, Chinese, Malaysians, Eastern Europeans, basically everybody with a computer and some warm bodies. This business doesn't even have many actual employees. Most are independent contractors working on a contract to contract basis. They are all self-employed. The ones working for IT sweatshops aren't even employees. They get no benefits and have no secure employment.

    So, in conclusion, I think my 17,500 (10% of the inflated Indian claim) to 25,000 American jobs created by Indian IT firms is spot on.

    [​IMG]
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  8. Aramsogo
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    Please be quiet while the adults are talking. I'll have a Monterey Chicken Taquito and a Buffalo Chicken Roller please.
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  10. foxbat
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  11. Vinod2070
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    I guess even that profession is called IT. ;)

    You are not so much off the mark!
  12. Developereo
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    Developereo PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT

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    You are absolutely right that this is a deliberate misinformation campaign by India's NASSCOM. They purposefully use vague language to give the wrong impression that their 107,000 employees are American citizens/PR.

    Here are the numbers from their own data:

    Total "direct" jobs: 107,000
    Total "indirect" jobs (i.e. waitress, hairdresser, courier) affected by the above "direct" jobs: 175,000
    Total jobs: 282,000

    Now, these "indirect" jobs are low paying, unskilled jobs which would not have work-permit folks, i. e. they are mostly all held by US residents.

    NASSOM further claim that 75% of total jobs are held by US nationals. So, 75% of 280,000 = 210,000 US jobs. But 175,000 of these are the "indirect" jobs above, which means that about (210,000 - 175,000 =) 35,000 jobs are held by US residents.

    So, putting it all together, out of the 107,000 high-paying "direct" jobs, only 35,000 (33%) are held by US residents, the rest are held by H1-B holders.

    Hence the snake oil statement by NASSCOM that Indian companies provide 107,000 jobs in the US is bullcrap. 67% of them are imported Indian workers.

    P.S. Also keep in mind that we are taking NASSCOM numbers on faith. The reality is likely to be even worse.
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  13. Vinod2070
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    And the canard continues.......
  14. foxbat
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    foxbat SENIOR MEMBER

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  15. Hello_10
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    Sir, healthy discussions would always be welcomed as they let us get to know the truth, to help us get introduced to the problems, where they exists and how to solve them.

    Last year, few of my friends said that there were so many attacks is Australia including in US/ UK during 2009/10, were similar to how people of Delhi and Mumbai don’t want Bihari labors. And I answered, “do you know how Bihari labors type people are treated in Australia? we have a detention center in Sydney where we have around 150 to 200 Afghan boat people who came to Australia due to NATO’s bombing there and they are kept in that detention center for over 2 years, 10 -12 have committed suicide there also, but still they are kept there like animals and haven't got 'refugee visa' also. Australia invites over 200,000 skilled migrants per year its because they fall in "Skill Demand List", making them in need in Australia.” (and logic behind giving US 'Permanent Visa' is, they dont want highly qualified people like us to get valuable experience and run from US/ UK/ Australia/ Canada type country.) We do have Marathas like Sachin Tendulkar in India who says Mumbai belongs to all the Indians but you can’t expect the same from rest of the world, just travel and see how things are, see in between 1.10 min to 1.55min :angry:



    Those who studied ME with me in UTS are now on over $150,000/ year job and in Australia if you earn over $110,000 per year then you pay 45% tax on your earning. and where this tax go? get to know, we have ‘Baby Boomers’ in big number there who have over 10 to 12 kids and they maintain luxury life because of the government money they get for their kids. A big ratio of Australian women are ‘Single Mother’, who are mother of over 2 to 12 kids who don’t have 'known' father and if they don’t get money from the government, their kids will beg on the streets. But the story is little more serious, that is, in absence of just 4-5 professionals on a mine site, over 50 technicians and 200 labors remain unemployed. that’s why it is said in Australia, "highly Qualified Skilled Migrants help create jobs in Australia for local labors." while along with high qualified people, we find too many trade/ nurse type migrants there also as there is simply no 'skill' in Australia :agree:

    But things of US, we are concerned are little more different. it is generally talked by the Indian professionals in US, "if US companies don’t take those Indian professionals who are from high ranked institutes like UTS, just for 4-5 years, US will have lost the edge in technologies." Even if a US’s sector like their defense sectors, MicroSoft, NASA, GE, GM etc have 1000s of migrant professionals, their main key techs are developed by their main top class professionals and Indians are in big numbers in them. whatever tax the top US’s firm pay to their government by selling their high tech products, it mainly because they have those top class professionals who helped them get those high techs. Just have a look on the average GMAT score of Indian institutes and compare with rest of the world, no one is near them. Even if US’s universities could have above 700 average then its because of those migrant students who got admission there due to very highs marks with offer of scholarship there. just google GRE/ GMAT scores and see how many of them are Indians among the top scorers, and then compare with rest of the world, like as below

    Global 200 Top Business Schools 2010 by Region | TOPMBA


    A country like US is made by the highly qualified migrants. I remember, It used to be the time till 90s when skill migration by US used to be called by the developing countries as ‘Brain Drain’, to take away key skills from the developing countries like India :pop:

    And if we have a look on the fall of US since recession period of 2008, then it was the same time when we find Indian professionals started coming back to India from US as now India is also developed enough so why to live in US now? so now it is obvious that US/ West are now in the position of crying for recession every month as those who were feeding the US's/ Western nationals are now going back to India :wave:

    Its funny to say that people of US/ UK/ Australia/ Canada enjoy their life and have good fun because they born there :lol:. There is a reason why these countries of under high school pass people are categorized as developed countries, and it’s their highly qualified migrants. As, how under high school pass people will develop technologies or fill high skill need of Industries, a common sense? I dont find much difference between illitrates of Congo/ Afghan with under high school passed people of US/ UK/ Australia except the fact that these developed countries get skilled migrants :pop:
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