Henry Kissinger: We must destroy the Chongqing Model

Discussion in 'Chinese Defence Forum' started by FairAndUnbiased, Mar 22, 2012.

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  1. conworldus
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    conworldus FULL MEMBER

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    Guys this article is entirely fake. Kissinger does not write in bad English!

    英文水平太差了,还基辛格。人家的文章看过没有?都是非常专业,非常绅士的。这篇文章像非英语国家人写的。
  2. FairAndUnbiased
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    FairAndUnbiased SENIOR MEMBER

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    I translated this myself.
  3. conworldus
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    conworldus FULL MEMBER

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    I am talking about the English part. Do you honestly think that a veteran diplomat like Kissinger write such bad English? Come on!
  4. FairAndUnbiased
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    FairAndUnbiased SENIOR MEMBER

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    It was originally translated into Chinese, and I translated it back into English. I do not have the original English copy.

    I do not think my English is that bad. If it was, then I apologize. According to this, I wrote at a 9th grade level, which is a bit better than the average student here.

    http://bluecentauri.com/tools/writer/sample.php
  5. conworldus
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    conworldus FULL MEMBER

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    比如说第一段话吧:

    “In 2012, China is facing (weak sentence: should say "China faces") a new leadership transition. Decisions have already been made. (comment: choppy sentences and unnecessary use of passive voice) Although instability (instability of what?) is possible, this (this refers to what? ambiguous) is an unknown variable, but China's internal "software" (No idea what this means. Need reference.) determines the fate (very undiplomatic choice of words. It is too absolute) of the world and the US (In formal reports, one should always say "the United States" in full)."

    Then it is probably faked by a Chinese blogger. I have read numerous Kissinger articles in "Foreign Affairs" magazine. His reports are diplomatic and very in-depth. This article sounds very shallow anyway.

    Don't worry I am not criticizing your English level. I am just evaluating the writing with a professional standard.
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  6. FairAndUnbiased
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    FairAndUnbiased SENIOR MEMBER

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    There's numerous other evidences that show that the highly radicalized conservatives are happy about his downfall. I posted one before I think. Therefore, we should not trust be brainwashed by them. I am not saying blindly support Bo Xilai, but to critically evaluate all the evidence, without prejudice, with a long historical view (as in remembering what he did before he was at Chongqing) and with common sense.
  7. longyi
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    longyi FULL MEMBER

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    I agree with you and I even go one step further. The original English version, which translated into the Chinese version that posted here, must be bogus. It's unlikely for Kissinger, at this stage of his life, to change course and muddles in what is China's internal affairs. This is below him.

    A few days ago I also saw a thread posted in this forum about him and India. Could that be a scam too?
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  8. conworldus
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    conworldus FULL MEMBER

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    I am pretty happy about his downfall, too. The guy ran huge deficit in both Chongqing and Dalian just to feed his ego. This is exactly what Mao did during the "Great Leap Forward", which also had popular support initially. The problem is that this is not sustainable because re-distributing wealth with brute force simply destroys social production efficiency, and Bo is just too freakin' evil to care about that. All he cared about was his personal power which mirrored closely with Mao. But Bo is not Mao and he will never be, hence he fails. There is nothing radical or conservative about this.

    This is a very recent article by Kissinger on US China relationship. You can only read the first few paragraphs for free.

    The Future of U.S.-Chinese Relations | Foreign Affairs
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  9. shuttler
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    shuttler ELITE MEMBER

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    There are some credibilities to the article regardless of the source or whether it is written in "professional standards" or not.
    When you read the article as a stand alone piece of writing, the following descriptions are actually happening in geopolitics targeting China:
    "We must support separatism and instability in China's western regions. At the same time, we must gain support among our European and Asian allies to speak out against China's human rights situation and direct specific criticism towards the human rights violations in Chongqing. China's leaders think we're idiots. They think that the South China Faction (a faction made up of liberals and capitalists) and a few liberal papers like South China Morning Post can distract the US from China's reality."

    Thank you Fairandunbiased for bringing the article to the fore.
  10. FairAndUnbiased
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    FairAndUnbiased SENIOR MEMBER

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    So what if he runs a deficit? Governments are supposed to run deficits sometimes. You really think at the beginning, Shenzhen and Shanghai EARNED their money? :lol: They paid for their infrastructure from local taxes alone? LMAO. They either went into debt or the national government gave them free money. Chongqing wasn't blessed by the national government to get free money, so they went into debt.

    You can't do anything without debt these days. He also attracted a 7 billion dollar investment from Samsung that just got transferred to Xi'an, which would've easily been made back but now Chongqing lost all that money and Acer invested to create the largest unified computer manufacture, logistics and research center in all of China in Chongqing. Damn, this guy must be so fking evil to have attracted billions in investment even as he was reducing the wealth gap. His government lost money, the people of Chongqing made money.

    He must've been fking evil when he was Minister of Commerce too :lol: I mean he only presided over the greatest expansion of the Chinese economy in all of history, no big deal, he's an evil Cultural Revolution guy that's too damn dumb and evil to see the error of his ways :lol: you should get a job from the Heritage Foundation.

    Know why Africa doesn't attract foreign investors except to take their resources and use their cheap labor, while Norway attracts investors even though it has very high wages? Because Norway doesn't have a Gini index of 50+ and is a fair, equitable society.

    Bo Xilai wanted Chongqing to be like Norway.

    The neocons want all of China to be like Africa.
  11. conworldus
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    conworldus FULL MEMBER

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    So you think Shenzhen is like Africa? Shanghai is like Africa?

    Chongqing is not Norway okay? Norway has vast oil and mineral production that it gets money from. What does Chongqing have? Overloading yourself with debt for no production purpose is exactly what Mao did for the "great leap forward". Do you endorse that, too? Europe's social welfare model emerged only after the Europeans working extremely hard and low wage for a long time after world war 2, and even that is not sustainable evident in light of the recent debt crisis. Look at Greece. Bo would turn Chongqing into much poorer version of Greece.

    Attracting foreign investment from Samsung? Great. First he killed off all the private Chinese companies, and then brought a foreign one to save his face. This won't fool anyone. All his crimes can compile a very long list and I have no intention to post them here.

    Right now I am just happy that he is gone, and hopefully along with all of his backings and cronies (and you probably know who I am talking about).

  12. FairAndUnbiased
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    FairAndUnbiased SENIOR MEMBER

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    No lmao, Mao went into ZERO debt. China had ZERO debt for the first 30 years. How did he fund his programs? Taxes and printing money and then instating a price cap. Indeed, China's foreign exchange GREW throughout the 50's, 60's and 70's in the one currency that mattered - gold. China's gold reserves went from 0 to 400 tons in 1976.

    Know who put us in the most debt? Your heroes Jiang Zemin and Zhu Rongji. You know who borrowed the most money (of course, not from their own people, from the rest of the country)? Shenzhen and Shanghai.

    What's wrong with Greece? Why does every nation have to be Germany? China is much bigger than the EU in both area and population. There's gonna be Greeks, and there's gonna be Italians, and there's gonna be Germans. We in the interior care about quality of life, safety and recreation, and as long as there's enough jobs and money to go around, we're fine. In the past few years, immigration away from Chongqing has decreased dramatically. People vote with their feet.

    He killed off private companies? Last I checked, private companies in Chongqing like Li Fan Motors are making record profits. It helps business when you kill off mafia bosses that shake you down for money all the time. And even if he did, why is it wrong to kill off low tech copying private companies that use the people as slaves? There is almost no innovation by private companies in China. The most high tech companies in China are all state owned, with the exception of 2: Huawei and ZTE, and even ZTE is state sponsored and was founded by the Ministry of Aerospace. He gave struggling state owned enterprises money so they could innovate and restructure, and they did. Wang Yang is also killing off low tech copying private companies in Guangdong right this minute.

    Chongqing's economy grew at a record pace during his office, and that is undeniable. All the debt he incurred would've been paid back within 5 years.

    60% of Shanghai is owned by the government, sorry. Its exactly like Singapore, with 4x lower wages.

    And just one more thing: Bo Xilai was Minister of Commerce for 4 years. The guy that controls trade policy for the entire nation. Economic growth was up, debt was down, during his administration. He is no idiot and his track record proves it.
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  13. OrionHunter
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    OrionHunter ELITE MEMBER

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    Typical Yank mentality! I think it would be a good idea to take their brain cells out of their casings and send them for detailed psychological analyses! We can then identify and dispose off the rogue cells in those Yanky brains so that they start thinking like ordinary peace loving humans beings! :hitwall:
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  14. WS-10 Engine
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    WS-10 Engine BANNED

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    This article is definitely from kissinger. Kissinger and zbigniew brezinski are 2 of the smartest people that understand china and Chinese history. They like china but they will never allow china to overtake American power.

    The only way anyone can stop chinas rise is to collapse china from within. When china is united, it's very tough to stop china. But when china was divided for hundreds of years, foreigners exploited china.

    America cannot use military force against china, china is too strong to risk military clash. America's only hope is to use NGOs and western journalist to divide china from within like how the west tried against Vladimir Putin recently.

    China cannot be controlled like Japan or south Korea. So they will try to contain china and cause internal conflict.
    Chinese model succeeding is a another threat to the west as most are starting to question western capitalism.

    Bo xilai is a true Chinese patriot. His model was successful. He could unite people and gain support from the people.

    China must get rid of foreign NGOs and western journalists out of china. They are both western tools to collapse governments around the world.

    Kissinger should never be trusted. Anyone trusting foreigners are extremely gullible people.

    I support Bo xilai.
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  15. FairAndUnbiased
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    FairAndUnbiased SENIOR MEMBER

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    Chang'an Automobile Group - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Note: Changan Motors alone makes up 10% of all vehicles manufactured in China. If Chang'an was a country, it would be the 13th biggest automaking nation in the world.

    They attained record profits and came out with an electric vehicle during Bo Xilai's administration. So much for killing of private enterprise.

    Lifan Group - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Chongqing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia