FC-31 v2.0 First flight 2016.12.23

[Shotgunner51]

My friend,

Americans develop all of these things.

All? Please share with me one American name that developed sub-micron 5-axis interlink CNC machine? And one that developed T1000 carbon fibre?

 

[LeGenD]

All? Give me one example of US developed sub-micron 5-axis interlink CNC machine?

Owens Industries Inc, founded in 1944.

Don't let their business practices fool you. Many American companies might ship raw materials (or components) to factories in China to develop relevant products for the consumers but the blueprints of those products come from the parent companies directly. And Chinese workforce gets to work after that.

However, years of manufacturing insight enabled China to develop its own Industrial capability which is good.

 

[Shotgunner51]

Owens Industris Inc, founded in 1944.

Don't let their business practices fool you. They might ship raw materials to China to develop their products for the consumers but the blueprints of those products come from them directly. And Chinese workforce gets to work after that.

However, years of manufacturing insight enabled China to develop its own Industrial capability which is good.

Owens Industries? Please show me one sub-micron CNC they make.

 

[Shotgunner51]

http://www.owensind.com/CNCServices/5AxisMachining

Anything else?

Sure, it's +/- 5 micron, where is precision level sub-micron?

 

[LeGenD]

Sure, precision level sub-micron?

Sure: http://www.owensind.com/CNCServices/PrecisionMachining

 

[Shotgunner51]

Sure: http://www.owensind.com/CNCServices/PrecisionMachining

Sure, it's +/- 5 micron, where is precision level sub-micron?

 

[LeGenD]

The company has nothing sub-micron military grade, so not this American, obviously. Which American develop sub-mciron CNC?

http://www.owensind.com/CNCServices/Micromachining

Also, which American developed T1000 carbon fiber?

http://www.toraycfa.com/pdfs/T1000GDataSheet.pdf

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You think that Americans will request Chinese firms to supply them parts for use in their classified or sensitive projects?

 

[Shotgunner51]

http://www.owensind.com/CNCServices/Micromachining

Owens again, nothing sub-micron. Must be another American? Who?

P.S.:

U.S. Precision Machine Tool Industry Is No Longer A Global Competetitive Force | Manufacturing and Technology News

"There are six American companies dedicated to producing five-axis machine tools, and at least 20 in China. Five-axis tools are used for the production of precision components in the aerospace industry...."

BIS found that half of the commercial five-axis machine tools are purchased for government contracts. The majority of these purchases are used solely for the purpose of government work. "Non-U.S. produced models made up 64 percent of five-axis simultaneous control machine tool models in the inventory of U.S. government contractors,"

Critical Technology Assessment: Five Axis Simultaneous Control Machine Tools (p. 48)

http://www.toraycfa.com/pdfs/T1000GDataSheet.pdf

Yes this is the one who developed T1000, Toray, good job. But wait, when does Toray, native name 東レ株式会社, become American?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toray_Industries

You think that Americans will request Chinese firms to supply them parts for use in highly classified or sensitive projects?

No, the question was do Americans supply themselves everything, 100% indigenous, you said yes, didn't you?

 

[The SC]

A general question: was there ever a fighter plane made only for export?
There is an (x) factor surrounding the real intent of the FC-31..is it China/Pakistan specific like the JF-17, a follow on with a long term possibility of being accompanied by the J-20?

Expert's opinions and most opinions are sought..

 

[LeGenD]

Owens again, nothing sub-micron. Must be another American? Who?

From the link: Owens Industries provides miniature and micromachining CNC services using Wire EDM, Sink EDM, and 5 Axis Machining Centers.

Micromachining CNC services enable sub-micron level accuracy in production. Did you check the link or just trolling me? Why don't you contact that company (i.e. Owen Industries) to get the answers you need? Do you think that Americans will tell you everything on a website?

Yes this is the one who developed T1000, Toray, good job. But wait, when does Toray become American?

That is American subsidiary of that company.

Anyways, several American companies develop carbon fiber materials domestically. You will find some information here: http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...fibre-reinforced-plastics-afrp-518812761.html

 

[Shotgunner51]

From the website: Owens Industries provides miniature and micromachining CNC services using Wire EDM, Sink EDM, and 5 Axis Machining Centers.

Micromachining CNC offers sub-micron accuracy and such. Did you check the link or trolling me? Why don't you contact that company to get the necessary answers? Do you think that Americans will tell you everything on a website?

Do you bother to read what you find on the web? Precision means linear precision accuracy, not any gage techniques including their magnification camera inspection system for measurements. My question is simple: Any American can make sub-micron level, in linear precision accuracy, 5-axis CNC machines with travels for any linear axis greater than 3 mt, that's required for aeronautical components?

P.S. Speaking of camera, it remind me to ask you the next question, do American produce 100% optic lens/sensor components on fighter jets?

That is American subsidiary of that company.

Toray, native name 東レ株式会社, founded 1926, is a multinational corporation, branches everywhere, you see their US branch and that makes them American?

 

[Blue Marlin]

Do you bother to read what you find on the web? Precision means linear precision accuracy, not any gage techniques including their magnification camera inspection system for measurements. My question is simple: Any American can make sub-micron level, in linear precision accuracy, 5-axis CNC machines with travels for any linear axis greater than 3 mt, that's required for aeronautical components?

P.S. Speaking of camera, it remind me to ask you the next question, do American produce 100% optic lens/sensor components on fighter jets?


They are a multinational corporation, branches everywhere, you see their US branch and that makes them American?

does china make 5 axis cnc machines? if so can you send a few links?
regards

 

[Shotgunner51]

does china make 5 axis cnc machines? if so can you send a few links?
regards

Sure, machine tool along with say steel/metallurgical are foundations for overall industrial base. China is world largest user and producer of machine tools. There are numerous manufacturers, Shenyang (SYMG) and Dalian (DMTG) are among largest, anyway check:

Gardner Research: 2016 World Machine Tool Survey (Data & Ranking by Country)
https://defence.pk/threads/gardner-...ranking-by-country.468126/page-2#post-9080560​

Also check post #236 above.

@Martian2 Please re-post about China exporting hi-precision CNC to Russia for areo-engine component machining.

 

[Akasa]

F-22 Raptor is 100% indigenous aircraft design.

F-35 is a multi-national project but Americans did the heavy-lifting in it. Why do you think it is identified as a product of Lockheed Martin? Why not a Turkish firm?

Americans are pioneers of modern aircraft designs and nobody matches their experience and expertise in this field.

There needs to be a distinction between "design" and an aircraft project as a holistic entity. The F-22's airframe or "design" is indigenous (as are the J-20, FC-31, & T-50 to their respective countries of origin), but no complex military platform today avoids sourcing at least some of its subcomponents from international vendors.

 

[Beast]

I don't live in pipe dreams I have seen Chinese and western equipment first hand and I know the difference and since long how Pakistan have helped China to improve it's tech due to access to western equipment and tech.

Edit.

For those who are in disbelief that Europe can't built 5th gen, the have capability to built 5th gen UCAV.

http://www.dassault-aviation.com/en/defense/neuron/introduction/

Pakistan should not take route of buying export oriented (water down tech) 5th gen J-31/FC-31 which is not accepted by the making country air force. If possible take route of building one in house with support of all close friendly countries.

It is funny you link a UCAV to prove evidence of Dassault capable of producing 5th gen fighter to compete with F-22 and J-20.

Let me ask u this simple question? How many G can it pull compare to 5th gen fighter? Can it dogfight? What kind of AESA radar can it carry? How many payload can it load compare real 5th gen? Can it supercruise?

This UCAV does not demonstrate any of your point about Western Europe capable of producing of a 5th gen fighter.

Do you bother to read what you find on the web? Precision means linear precision accuracy, not any gage techniques including their magnification camera inspection system for measurements. My question is simple: Any American can make sub-micron level, in linear precision accuracy, 5-axis CNC machines with travels for any linear axis greater than 3 mt, that's required for aeronautical components?

P.S. Speaking of camera, it remind me to ask you the next question, do American produce 100% optic lens/sensor components on fighter jets?


Toray, native name 東レ株式会社, founded 1926, is a multinational corporation, branches everywhere, you see their US branch and that makes them American?

Hi,these fake Pakistanis don't even bother to do basic research and just jump to conclusion based on perception. It's something irritating to speak to them even presented with facts and they purposely avoid the point and blindly wishfully just wanted to present their points.

I once talk to a Pakistanis who brag Pakistan is capable of producing modern fighter jet by themselves. I ask for modern hi tech wind tunnel available in Pakistan and he give me a tiny wind tunnel only capable of simulating small projectile as proof of pakistan wind tunnel for modern testing.. While you keep telling them the facts about criteria of producing modern jet. They will twist their way and just sprout rubbish just to suit their own ear. They is a reason why even India need to send their Kaveri engine to Russia to test for their LCA project.

They are still the Pakistanis who still think Pakistan future ties with western and they are too blind to see the advancement of China. The J-20 has not a single component from Russian. Even the engine is WS-10B as many claim of AL-31F engine. How can AL-3F engine allows picking up attitude without igniting after burner?

How many 3D printing has input into PAFKA by Russian? Zero.