Can Chinese System be the Ultimate Solution Against Radical Islam?

[Indos]

With 250 million people we still manage to be the most democratic nation in entire South East Asia. Still not perfect though, but we are much more advanced in political system than much smaller country like Malaysia and city state like Singapore.

Democracy can also give broad road into a very capable new leader in the future and suppress corruption because of its media openness and social media effect. Joko Widodo even though still not perfect is an example of our leadership recruitment process that become more effective due to democracy system.

 

[Nan Yang]

(My English is not good,I hope you can understand what I say..)

Yes...And poverty gap between Han and Uighur in Xinjiang is huge.(It causes mentality unbalance)
However,let me say more...It isn't the government's fault or due to unfair treatment..
What you should know firstly.
**Most(88.15%) Uighur live in South Xinjiang.(Kashgar-36.01%,Hotan-18%+,Akesu-18%+,Kizilsu,Bayingolin)
--Resource:新疆维吾尔族人口的比例及分布图 - 社会学 - 道客巴巴

View attachment 277148
In all 56 ethnic groups,Uighur is in the lower middle level(According to PQLI in many years ago,and it is said that the gap between Uighur and most other ethnic group is widening)
They are lack of education and most of them can't speak mandarin.(especially the old)
Most of them are poorly educated,so they are easy to be incited..

Why Uighur is poor?
Since Sink Road has been neglected by the world(cuz the prosperous marine transportation industry took the place of surface transport),Uighur could't earn much by trade,then they became backward.
South Xinjiang is surrounded by high mountains,transportation relies highly on road,it is a natural barrier which prevent Uighur from being rich and living well.(It's a long-lasting problem,maybe it is sloved now,but their undevelopement will last for a long time)
They are lack of big cities,which can be a demonstration center of development in many respects,such as technology,consumption,moral,culture and economy,etc.Although some of their county-cities become so-called city now,you can truely ignore their influences...(And South Xinjiang is far away from Urumqi,where Uighur lives is hard to get economic pervasion and industry transfer)
Therefore,Uighur itself is a closed ethnic group,it is lack of communication with other ethnic groups and the outside world.
They love their native land,though they will live in poverty,most of them hardly leave South Xinjiang.(Those who can get a high pay job in other provinces almost quit and go back to South Xinjiang after finishing college study)
In most cases,people in undeveloped area will move out and look for a job,especially in villages,most youth live village and head for big cities,but Uighur is different from Han.

Farmers are religious,value their religion much more than material life.
People don't set up competition awareness.(2015 there is a Uighur girl became a science champion,however she lives in Urumqi,so it can't stand for the situation of South Xinjiang...)

Incite
I remember a previous rumor,it incited ethnic relations between Uighur and other ethnic groups,and unfortunately many people believe it...It's shameful...I don't want to say what it is...
But it does harm to the Uighur people who move to inland/coastal area.
Now it's suspected that someone incites on purpose...
Well...Can you read Chinese?I can send relative article to you...


What are these flags?Is there a CCP flag?


Months before the most famous TV station in China showed great scenery in Turkey,many Chinese soon fell in love with Turkey's scenery,and wanted to travel in Turkey.However the attack shocked Chinese...
View attachment 277332 View attachment 277333 View attachment 277334 View attachment 277335
View attachment 277330

You brought out a good point that is uneven development.

When you have a group of the same ethnic race living together in poverty, its a potential for unrest. Imagine you wake up every morning and see you people around you everyday living in poverty. It has a negative re enforcing effect.

In Malaysia the 1969 race riots was sparked by an election, but the root cause was uneven development that caused tension to build up over the years between the poorer Malays living in the under developed country side versus the richer Chinese living in the cities.
After the riots, Malays were moved into the cities and given preferential treatment creating a Malay middle class.

Lee Kuan Yew also recognized this during the early days of Singapore. That is why he got rid of Malay "ghettos" and scatter them evenly throughout Singapore.

Many problems in this world can be solved by bringing development to under privileged people.

 

[oproh]

Buddhists, Taoists, Christians, Muslims, Catholics held a sports meet in China.

This is wonderful.

 

[Rasengan]

(My English is not good,I hope you can understand what I say..)

Sorry for responding late my Chinese friend and I can understand your sentences perfectly well

Yes...And poverty gap between Han and Uighur in Xinjiang is huge.(It causes mentality unbalance)
However,let me say more...It isn't the government's fault or due to unfair treatment..
What you should know firstly.
**Most(88.15%) Uighur live in South Xinjiang.(Kashgar-36.01%,Hotan-18%+,Akesu-18%+,Kizilsu,Bayingolin)
--Resource:新疆维吾尔族人口的比例及分布图 - 社会学 - 道客巴巴

The poverty gap between the Han and Uighur's in Xinjiang is extraordinarily huge. To some extent discontent exists because companies such as Xinjiang Production & Construction Corporation employ 90% of its workers from the Han community, which mean the younger generation of the Uighur community will feel discriminated against. Second the Government should have never issued the policy of a quota system in education where Uighur students are allowed to gain entry into Universities with lower marks. This is common sense because why should an employer chose a candidate who has applied for a vacancy in his organization, when realistically his academic credentials can be questioned. Obviously this outcome leads to a problem, because the ETIM would brainwash these educated youth who have no job to attack the government. The local government seriously needs to rethink its strategy and although the Uighur community lives mostly in Southern Xinjiang where the infrastructure facility is not as developed, they can do more to bridge the gap between both communities. We have the same problem in Baluchistan where the population is uneducated, however local government policy is not good enough to create a balance. In this entire forum, I am one of the few Pakistani's who has worked in China and majority of my best friends are Chinese from, Chengdu, Kunming, Dalian, Beijing, Shanghai, Guangzhou and various cities in Jiangsu Province. Therefore, the stability and security of China is important to me personally because I care about my brothers. ETIM must be destroyed, however a good general only fights one battle instead of a hundred to win. Most of the Uighur's cannot speak Mandarin and I have seen this in front of my eyes in Chengdu in a restaurant. One of my Chinese Han brother wanted me to experience Uighur cuisine so when we visited a shop, the waiter could understand me more than my Chinese brother. The only word he understood in Mandarin was "this" when looking at the menu.

View attachment 277148
In all 56 ethnic groups,Uighur is in the lower middle level(According to PQLI in many years ago,and it is said that the gap between Uighur and most other ethnic group is widening)
They are lack of education and most of them can't speak mandarin.(especially the old)
Most of them are poorly educated,so they are easy to be incited..

The Government needs to educate them and in Xinjiang the education system should include Mandarin and Uighur language to protect the local culture. Every single ethnic group in China has contributed to the civilization of China, therefore such a treasure should be cultivated and protected for future generations to learn from.

Why Uighur is poor?
Since Sink Road has been neglected by the world(cuz the prosperous marine transportation industry took the place of surface transport),Uighur could't earn much by trade,then they became backward.
South Xinjiang is surrounded by high mountains,transportation relies highly on road,it is a natural barrier which prevent Uighur from being rich and living well.(It's a long-lasting problem,maybe it is sloved now,but their undevelopement will last for a long time)

The Silk Road has been forgotten, however Xinjiang is rich with mineral resources. Hotan White Jade a couple of years ago was being sold in the market for 10,000 RMB per kilo and price must have risen since the government has issued a quota on how much can be mined each year. However this billion dollar industry has benefited a small group of individuals rather than the collective community as a whole. Southern Xinjiang has a difficult terrain, however the Government will bring investment and infrastructure development in the near future, because the economic corridor in Pakistan can only be successful with a much more prosperous Xinjiang.

Farmers are religious,value their religion much more than material life.
People don't set up competition awareness.(2015 there is a Uighur girl became a science champion,however she lives in Urumqi,so it can't stand for the situation of South Xinjiang...)

The number one most important thing for Muslims is there religion and everything else is secondary and the Chinese should try to understand this. A person can be a law abiding citizen and be religious in nature. Material life should never be the number focus, because money and fame cannot be taken to the grave, although this is my opinion In addition, from my own experience the Uighur communities knowledge of Islam is limited when I visited a mosque in Beijing.

Incite
I remember a previous rumor,it incited ethnic relations between Uighur and other ethnic groups,and unfortunately many people believe it...It's shameful...I don't want to say what it is...
But it does harm to the Uighur people who move to inland/coastal area.
Now it's suspected that someone incites on purpose...
Well...Can you read Chinese?I can send relative article to you...

Unfortunately I cannot read Chinese, since I always get my brothers to inform me about the ground situation of China, because I never read bias western media articles on China. However In'sha'allah the relationship between the Uighur and Han will improve. The Government should take the narrative of Islam away from its fight against ETIM, which it actually does to its credit. The Hui are living quite nicely in China, therefore the propaganda by the West in accusing the CCP government of oppressing the Muslims is false.

 

[Jlaw]

The poverty gap between the Han and Uighur's in Xinjiang is extraordinarily huge. To some extent discontent exists because companies such as Xinjiang Production & Construction Corporation employ 90% of its workers from the Han community, which mean the younger generation of the Uighur community will feel discriminated against.

Do you have proof of that? In life nothing is fair. Companies will always hire the best people for the job unless it's stupid affirmative action given to certain groups. Chinese government have given Uighurs free passes in the past and they still can't make it.

Studying the Quaran all day, not learning the country's language is not going to improve the chances of finding employment. I'm sick of people blaming society for their own failure and not taking personal action to solve their issues, other than performing terrorist acts. No sympathy for lazy unproductive people.

 

[Dungeness]

The number one most important thing for Muslims is there religion and everything else is secondary and the Chinese should try to understand this. A person can be a law abiding citizen and be religious in nature. Material life should never be the number focus, because money and fame cannot be taken to the grave, although this is my opinion In addition, from my own experience the Uighur communities knowledge of Islam is limited when I visited a mosque in Beijing.

If the spiritual wealth is their first priority and everything else comes secondary, "the poverty gap between the Han and Uighur's in Xinjiang is extraordinarily huge" as you said, is the direct consequence of their own free choice. There is no way around it. You just can not have both ways.

 

[Rasengan]

Do you have proof of that? In life nothing is fair. Companies will always hire the best people for the job unless it's stupid affirmative action given to certain groups. Chinese government have given Uighurs free passes in the past and they still can't make it.

Studying the Quaran all day, not learning the country's language is not going to improve the chances of finding employment. I'm sick of people blaming society for their own failure and not taking personal action to solve their issues, other than performing terrorist acts. No sympathy for lazy unproductive people.

Are you seriously disputing this figure because its common knowledge that the XPCC is largely dominated by the Han community, since the organization was created in 1954 to help former solders that became demobilized after the civil war to settle down. Since 1954 migration has increased and personally nothing is wrong with this outcome, because every single citizen in China has the right to move freely and have access to living in an environment of their choosing. However the local Government should provide more equal jobs for the Uighur community in general by educating them. In Pakistan the province of Baluchistan is extremely backward and the vast majority of the population is uneducated. The Government of Baluchistan should have done more to create balance in the region when migration from Punjab was increasing due to new economic opportunities. However you can read the article "Ethnic Stratification amid China's Economic Transition: Evidence from the Xinjiang Uighur Autonomous Region" by Xiaogang Wu and Xi Song. In life nothing is fair and Companies will always hire the best candidate for the job, then why does the Government give a quota system in education to the Uighur's. What is the point in having educated Uighur youths, If companies will simply reject them based on their education credentials. I am advocating the idea that the Uighur community should receive no special privileges by the Government, because everyone should live under one policy.The only privilege which should be given depending on the income of the family is finance towards their education, however this policy should also apply to Han individuals as well and not just provided to the Uighur community. Building a nation takes time and Xinjiang is no different, however some form of strategy should be examined in how the communities can bridge the gap. The Hui are more religious than the Uighur and this is from my own experience in China, although the Hui were historically influenced by Sufism, while the Uighur's have its roots from Salafism.

If you understood Islam and the Quran itself then you would obviously know a Muslim cannot be reading the Holy Book all day as its been discouraged in the Hadith. Learning a countries language is important, however its the Government's duty to make sure this action happens because they were given power by the people and not the other way round. In addition, in my opinion the Government should make it compulsory for all students to learn Mandarin and have optional elective subjects in learning Uighur. Be more specific in which particular type of people are you sick of who blame society for their own failures? Are you saying Muslims's in general across the world or the Uighur's

If the spiritual wealth is their first priority and everything else comes secondary, "the poverty gap between the Han and Uighur's in Xinjiang is extraordinarily huge" as you said, is the direct consequence of their own free choice. There is no way around it. You just can not have both ways.

In Islam we have a spiritual education which teachers us to cleanse our heart of hatred and negativity, however the physical plane is just as important. An individual can be religious and be successful in business, however money should never dictate a person's life to a degree of obsession. First a person should find a job to earn an income to look after his parents which in Islam is the son's obligation. Second marriage in Islam is important because in the Hadith it mentions how half of your religion is completed by performing this action. However obviously you need money to marry, because its the husband's duty in Islam to provide for his wife. Therefore a person should have a balance between the spiritual plane and the physical plane. I can also heavily criticize the Uighur community and my comments would be harsh, because under Islamic philosophy which is difficult to understand by Non-Muslim who have limited knowledge on the subject, the Uighur's are wrong in a number of cases with its relationship with the Government and the other communities around it.

 

[Dungeness]

In Islam we have a spiritual education which teachers us to cleanse our heart of hatred and negativity, however the physical plane is just as important. An individual can be religious and be successful in business, however money should never dictate a person's life to a degree of obsession. First a person should find a job to earn an income to look after his parents which in Islam is the son's obligation. Second marriage in Islam is important because in the Hadith it mentions how half of your religion is completed by performing this action. However obviously you need money to marry, because its the husband's duty in Islam to provide for his wife. Therefore a person should have a balance between the spiritual plane and the physical plane. I can also heavily criticize the Uighur community and my comments would be harsh, because under Islamic philosophy which is difficult to understand by Non-Muslim who have limited knowledge on the subject, the Uighur's are wrong in a number of cases with its relationship with the Government and the other communities around it.

It is all about prioritizing your life goals. In the US, if a Native American insists on spending his life practicing spiritual rituals and refusing learning English, there is no chance for him to have the same economical status as those in the mainstream of the society.

If Chinese government drags all Uighur school-age kids from Mosques and put them into regular bilingual schools, the whole world would be crying "cultural genocide". What exactly Chinese Government is supposed to do?

 

[Jlaw]

Are you seriously disputing this figure because its common knowledge that the XPCC is largely dominated by the Han community, since the organization was created in 1954 to help former solders that became demobilized after the civil war to settle down. Since 1954 migration has increased and personally nothing is wrong with this outcome, because every single citizen in China has the right to move freely and have access to living in an environment of their choosing. However the local Government should provide more equal jobs for the Uighur community in general by educating them. In Pakistan the province of Baluchistan is extremely backward and the vast majority of the population is uneducated. The Government of Baluchistan should have done more to create balance in the region when migration from Punjab was increasing due to new economic opportunities. However you can read the article "Ethnic Stratification amid China's Economic Transition: Evidence from the Xinjiang Uighur Autonomous Region" by Xiaogang Wu and Xi Song. In life nothing is fair and Companies will always hire the best candidate for the job, then why does the Government give a quota system in education to the Uighur's. What is the point in having educated Uighur youths, If companies will simply reject them based on their education credentials. I am advocating the idea that the Uighur community should receive no special privileges by the Government, because everyone should live under one policy.The only privilege which should be given depending on the income of the family is finance towards their education, however this policy should also apply to Han individuals as well and not just provided to the Uighur community. Building a nation takes time and Xinjiang is no different, however some form of strategy should be examined in how the communities can bridge the gap. The Hui are more religious than the Uighur and this is from my own experience in China, although the Hui were historically influenced by Sufism, while the Uighur's have its roots from Salafism.

If you understood Islam and the Quran itself then you would obviously know a Muslim cannot be reading the Holy Book all day as its been discouraged in the Hadith. Learning a countries language is important, however its the Government's duty to make sure this action happens because they were given power by the people and not the other way round. In addition, in my opinion the Government should make it compulsory for all students to learn Mandarin and have optional elective subjects in learning Uighur. Be more specific in which particular type of people are you sick of who blame society for their own failures? Are you saying Muslims's in general across the world or the Uighur's



In Islam we have a spiritual education which teachers us to cleanse our heart of hatred and negativity, however the physical plane is just as important. An individual can be religious and be successful in business, however money should never dictate a person's life to a degree of obsession. First a person should find a job to earn an income to look after his parents which in Islam is the son's obligation. Second marriage in Islam is important because in the Hadith it mentions how half of your religion is completed by performing this action. However obviously you need money to marry, because its the husband's duty in Islam to provide for his wife. Therefore a person should have a balance between the spiritual plane and the physical plane. I can also heavily criticize the Uighur community and my comments would be harsh, because under Islamic philosophy which is difficult to understand by Non-Muslim who have limited knowledge on the subject, the Uighur's are wrong in a number of cases with its relationship with the Government and the other communities around it.

Han Chinese were in Xinjiang long before Uighur existed but I'll save that for another thread. The government gives special incentives for Uighurs just like the same thing US government gave special treatment to blacks. Because their priories in life lie elsewhere instead of bettering themselves to serve the country but rather serving a fictitious character (again, I will not digress).
Nobody is going to give a job to anybody if they are not qualified. Do not give me this crap about because they are minority. Does discriminatory hiring practice happens in companies? Of course they do but for the most part these people do not qualify for the job they want.
I live in a majority white population but I have no problem finding a job in white companies because i meet all the qualifications. Overseas Chinese face more obstacles than Chinese Uighur by far but the vast majority is successful at what they do.

It is all about prioritizing your life goals. In the US, if a Native American insists on spending his life practicing spiritual rituals and refusing learning English, there is no chance for him to have the same economical status as those in the mainstream of the society.

If Chinese government drags all Uighur school-age kids from Mosques and put them into regular bilingual schools, the whole world would be crying "cultural genocide". What exactly Chinese Government is supposed to do?

let them learn the Quran but don't cry when they can't get a job. it's "my right to get a job even if I don't qualify because I've been discriminated against." mentality that is prominent in the loser segment of society.

 

[Jaanbaz]

with a Pakistan

You just can't keep your Pakistan obsession away can you? What did we do now?

 

[Rasengan]

It is all about prioritizing your life goals. In the US, if a Native American insists on spending his life practicing spiritual rituals and refusing learning English, there is no chance for him to have the same economical status as those in the mainstream of the society.

If Chinese government drags all Uighur school-age kids from Mosques and put them into regular bilingual schools, the whole world would be crying "cultural genocide". What exactly Chinese Government is supposed to do?

An individual should prioritize his life goals, because as human beings we are morally compelled to fulfill certain obligations to those around us. However under the philosophy of Islam education is extremely important as the ink of a scholar is more holier than the blood of a martyr. When the Holy Prophet (PBUH) captured prisoners of war, he use to free them if they could teach 10 people in how to read and write. Under the Golden period of Islam, the library of Baghdad was recognized as the wisdom center of the world at the time, because education was the central theme. The Uighur's should learn to speak Mandarin and in fact in Chengdu the waiter who served our table was reprimanded by me. However, the Government at the same time should have subjects as an option for them to learn Uighur language to maintain their heritage. The Chinese Government should force Uighur school children into regular bilingual schools, because even in the western world the vast majority of Muslim's go to normal schools, then in the evening spend an hour in the Mosque for Islamic studies. People study in Madrasas because in the developing world because there family life is poor and the institution pays for their education in which they wish to follow the career of an imam. In Islam its highly discouraged to rebel against the state, because it leads to fitna and unnecessary bloodshed which is forbidden. Thus the Uighur's who attack innocent people are not following Islam, instead the narrative of nationalism and ethnicity has come into the picture. The western world will always moan and whinge about China, however the Muslim world can say diddly squat if the freedom of practicing in your country is maintained. The best way to fight the Uighur terrorists is to use good imams to educate them on traditional philosophy and take Salafism out. However in my opinion this entire problem is more focused on nationalism rather than religion. You do know that the Uighur's for over 3 decades have been trying to convince the Mujaheddin in Afghanistan of their oppression, however there case has failed quite spectacularly because of Pakistan, but more importantly there case was religiously weak. There is a good reason why China has some form of communication with the Taliban through the ISI.

Han Chinese were in Xinjiang long before Uighur existed but I'll save that for another thread. The government gives special incentives for Uighurs just like the same thing US government gave special treatment to blacks. Because their priories in life lie elsewhere instead of bettering themselves to serve the country but rather serving a fictitious character (again, I will not digress).

I never advocated the idea that the Uighur community controls the sole legacy of Xinjiang and demographics have changed throughout history. I mentioned specifically in my previous message that the Government should not give special privileges to the Uighur community because everyone should be treated equally under the same law. It makes no logical sense because instead of creating unity an environment of segregation is created. The American Government gives preferential treatment to Black people because of historical reasons, such as slavery, internal war between the South/North and civil rights movement. However they should stop this policy in my opinion as the end result is always disastrous. I have spoken respectfully about China and I expect the same curtsy to our religious figures. The Prophet (PBUH) was not a fictitious character since his name and actions are mentioned in the books of the Persian Empire and the Byzantine Empire. Islam has a rich heritage in China and there are many wonderful stories.