One-state-solution? Two-state-solution? Well, what about the Move-State-Solution

Judge said:

We support the State of Israel for the support that Israel has given to India steadfastly in our time of need.
Hard as that may be for you to understand Sir, we are with Israel.

How Israel deals with Israeli citizens is an issue that is upto them. I am however willing to put money on the fact that those of 'Indian descent' are treated a hundred times more fairly and with more democratic rights than in any other Arab country.

So if you think that this is a criteria - on how a country treats or discriminates between its people - then Israel is without a single doubt the best country in that entire region and puts the rest of the countries there to utter shame.

All that said, India supports the official formation of a country - Palestine. We advocate that they form a country and live peacefully.

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You can support whatever you want to (don't care the slightest) but when some of you Indians (read many) are acting more "Israeli" than the Israelis themselves it becomes something that you almost have to point out. Maybe you cannot see that. Let me give you a few examples. KSA has many close partners, Arab as non-Arab but I don't feel the need to act more American than the Americans themselves. You got me?

Good for you. I suggest that you should convince Israel of hosting those millions of Indians that live in the Arab world then. I doubt that they would agree though. "They" as in Israel.

This thread is not about human rights but the right of Palestine to become a sovereign state. I am not against a Israeli state. It's a reality nor have I anything against Jews.

It's just strange that supposed "human rights champions" are silent on that part of the discussion. The rights of the Palestinians. Which this thread is basically about.

al-Hasani said:

You can support whatever you want to (don't care the slightest) but when some of you Indians (read many) are acting more "Israeli" than the Israelis themselves it becomes something that you almost have to point out. Maybe you cannot see that. Let me give you a few examples. KSA has many close partners, Arab as non-Arab but I don't feel the need to act more American than the Americans themselves. You got me?

Good for you. I suggest that you should convince Israel of hosting those millions of Indians that live in the Arab world then. I doubt that they would agree though. "They" as in Israel.

This thread is not about human rights but the right of Palestine to become a sovereign state. I am not against a Israeli state. It's a reality nor have I anything against Jews.

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If this thread is not about human rights and the millions of expat Indians, then maybe you should not have brought the issue up of Israelis of Indian descent who you said are treated unfairly.

Your pointing out something or not is irrelevant as the reality of Israel speaks for itself. Whether or not you feel Indians are acting more Israeli than the Israelis is also irrelevant to the discussion of Israel.

As far as Palestine is concerned, most of the world is on the same page on that including India. We support Palestine as an independent and sovereign country and have voted accordingly in the UN.

indians hate Muslims, and understandably so, since Muslims humiliated, destroyed, conquered, ruled, and divided india...and this "abuse" of hindu motherland went on for centuries and centuries at the hand of Muslims...

So no wonder indians feel satisfied by venting their frustration....albeit they do it online..which is even better for us!

Judge said:

If this thread is not about human rights and the millions of expat Indians, then maybe you should not have brought the issue up of Israelis of Indian descent who you said are treated unfairly.

Your pointing out something or not is irrelevant as the reality of Israel speaks for itself. Whether or not you feel Indians are acting more Israeli than the Israelis is also irrelevant to the discussion of Israel.

As far as Palestine is concerned, most of the world is on the same page on that including India. We support Palestine as an independent and sovereign country and have voted accordingly in the UN.

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It was a freaking side comment and nevertheless a correct side comment. Also do you have any evidence of Indians being treated more badly in UAE for instance than in Israel? No, you have not. Maybe you should consult all those Indian billionaires who live in the UAE or regular Indian users (Hindus) on PDF who live in the UAE/GCC if they are "oppressed" as you claim. They are not even citizens unlike the few Indian Israelis.

Given how this thread developed and others recently it was not irrelevant by any means and the 7-8 users that thanked my post obviously thought similarly.

Well, that's all I wanted to hear. Fair enough. No problem then. I was more referring to those Indians who are against a Palestinian state despite speaking about human rights and supporting Israel.

Two state solution is a thing of the past. Israel has simply eaten up too much Palestinian land, the West Bank isn't what it seems on maps at all.

al-Hasani said:

It was a freaking side comment and nevertheless a correct side comment. Also do you have any evidence of Indians being treated more badly in UAE for instance than in Israel? No, you have not. Maybe you should consult all those Indian billionaires who live in the UAE or regular Indian users (Hindus) on PDF who live in the UAE/GCC if they are "oppressed" as you claim. They are not even citizens unlike the few Indian Israelis.

Given how this thread developed and others recently it was not irrelevant by any means and the 7-8 users that thanked my post obviously thought similarly.

Well, that's all I wanted to hear. Fair enough. No problem then. I was more referring to those Indians who are against a Palestinian state despite speaking about human rights and supporting Israel.

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If a post being thanked is the criteria for what is correct and wrong - then you have some mistaken notions of reality.
The Indian billionaires who live in the UAE among other places in the world do so because they offer a quality of life that is better than India apart from having businesses located in that region. I hope you are well read enough to understand the difference between equal democratic rights and quality of life. The two are separate and may/may not overlap.

I dont think any Indian is against Palestine. We support Israels right to exist on the land it is on. We do not support Israeli expansionism. We support Palestine to have the land it was given to make a formal country and would like Palestinians to live in peace and prosper. This has been the official position of our Government as well apart from the very close relations that Indian leaders have had historically with Palestinian leaders.

The Sultan Erdogan said:

indians hate Muslims, and understandably so, since Muslims humiliated, destroyed, conquered, ruled, and divided india...and this "abuse" of hindu motherland went on for centuries and centuries at the hand of Muslims...

So no wonder indians feel satisfied by venting their frustration....albeit they do it online..which is even better for us!

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Actually Sir, we also do it in real life.
India invaded, defeated and split in half a neighbouring Muslim country. Read all about it.

@Judge

Yes, I understand that India has now turned into a beacon of freedom while UAE (which is much more popular for ordinary people, workers, billionaires etc.) is now several leagues below "might" India in this department. I forgot this.

I am afraid that you can't speak for all Indians here. What you write (some of it) is all good and fine but many of your compatriots are confirming what I have written earlier. Time and time again. I am sorry.

No point discussing this anymore.

al-Hasani said:

@Judge

Yes, I understand that India has now turned into a beacon of freedom while UAE (which is much more popular for ordinary people, workers, billionaires etc.) is now several leagues below "might" India in this department. I forgot this.

I am afraid that you can't speak for all Indians here. What you write (some of it) is all good and fine but many of your compatriots are confirming what I have written earlier. Time and time again. I am sorry.

No point discussing this anymore.

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I agree.
The bottom line however should always be what my Government says. The Government of India are our true representatives, chosen after massive elections and are the only ones qualified to speak on behalf of most, if not all Indians.

And they have reiterated their support for Palestine as recently as the last UN voting where we have voted in favour of admitting Palestine as a State in UN despite US and Israeli objections.

That however must not be construed as an indication that we are against Israel and support the terrorist demands of removal of Israel altogether and/or attacks on Israel.
Neither should our support for Israel be construed as a blind support for removal of Palestine and absorption into Israel(what is currently happening). Palestine should be allowed by the P-5 to form a country as originally envisioned. To deny that is against human principles of justice.

Tunisian Marine Corps said:

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This is the best option.

Create a "Jewish homeland" in US, India, Europe or any country where people cry about the Jews being oppressed and deserving their own land.

It's easy to feel compassionate when someone else (Palestinians) are getting killed and evicted from their homes. If these bleeding hearts feel so bad for Jews, let them colonize part of their country instead.

Here's the kicker: the Jewish colonialists get to decide which part of the target country they want to colonize, and ethnically cleanse to make room for a "Jewish State".

I would say what any brit will say about a new airport... bloody good idea but not near my house please.

BestUsernameEver said:

Why into the United States, why not into the Jewish Autonomous Oblast ?

Jewish Autonomous Oblast - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Btw the Jewish Autonomous Oblast was established in 1934, 14 years before Israel and is almost twice as big (36 thousand square kms vs Israels 20k).



Very true, I've noticed it as well.

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the pic is not my work i found it in facebook

Judge said:

You are right - before in history does not count.
As of this period - this age - the land belongs to Israel.

Your statement - that the land 'belongs to Palestinians' is incorrect. The land belongs to Israelis.

That said, your other statement, that of Israel taking up more land beyond what was agreed upon is indeed wrong. And that is indeed not Israeli land, it is indeed Palestinian land.

For that, Israel must be condemned. They should unilaterally vacate that extra land.

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Look, I don't oppose the existence of Israel. I said ''most of the land'', not ''all of the land''. The Jews did own land there before the creation of Israel, that land, and about 20-30% of Palestine with Jewish majority should have been allowed to become Israel. The problem started when they were given majority of the land while being the minority. Obviously, the local majority would oppose that. When their voice was not heard, they called upon the neighboring Arab states to intervene (of course, the Arabs had their own interests too).

Israel then proceeded to militarily take over the rest of Palestine. The thing is, it wasn't even ''agreed upon''. An agreement is when both sides agree to something. The Palestinians never got the chance to agree to anything, all the decisions were made by colonial powers or other foreigners. That's what caused the problem.

This is the best option for peace in that region.

TankMan said:

Look, I don't oppose the existence of Israel. I said ''most of the land'', not ''all of the land''. The Jews did own land there before the creation of Israel, that land, and about 20-30% of Palestine with Jewish majority should have been allowed to become Israel.

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I agree with this part.
Now Israel should be content instead of trying to get more and more land. That should be and is unacceptable.

Israel then proceeded to militarily take over the rest of Palestine. The thing is, it wasn't even ''agreed upon''. An agreement is when both sides agree to something. The Palestinians never got the chance to agree to anything, all the decisions were made by colonial powers or other foreigners. That's what caused the problem.

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I don't agree with this. Nations and people deal with the hand they are dealt with.
India was invaded repeatedly and geographies drawn without consent. We can not do anything about that today but to accept what happened and make our lot(country) better.

The same analogy is valid for Palestinians. Accept what has happened and make your lot better in life, the goal should be to make sure Palestinian citizens become more developed instead of the usual terrorist rhetoric of removing Israel and 'Muslim lands'.

It is my personal opinion that this can be achieved by non-violence only. Violence can be easily retaliated to by Israel. Non-violence however is very very powerful.

I am hopeful that one day Palestine will be the next Singapore or UAE.

Judge said:

I agree with this part.
Now Israel should be content instead of trying to get more and more land. That should be and is unacceptable.

I don't agree with this. Nations and people deal with the hand they are dealt with.
India was invaded repeatedly and geographies drawn without consent. We can not do anything about that today but to accept what happened and make our lot(country) better.

The same analogy is valid for Palestinians. Accept what has happened and make your lot better in life, the goal should be to make sure Palestinian citizens become more developed instead of the usual terrorist rhetoric of removing Israel and 'Muslim lands'.

It is my personal opinion that this can be achieved by non-violence only. Violence can be easily retaliated to by Israel. Non-violence however is very very powerful.

I am hopeful that one day Palestine will be the next Singapore or UAE.

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I think you misunderstood my point. The Palestinians, as a people, got very little say in what happened to their nation. It was mostly the colonial powers. There wasn't any vote to see whether the Palestinians wanted to let the Jews in. neither did they have any say on their land or their fate. That is extremely unfair. Just try to imagine being in their shoes. What happened with India is not even close to what continues to happen to the Palestinians.
Non-Violence is just as useless as violence until and unless the US stops supporting Israel's constant violation of UN resolutions and starts threatening Israel with the same sanctions it threatens Iran or North Korea or any other country it doesn't like.